Shiplist

[Gank]

Ok so we have to sort out need to get something concrete down here before people start making stuff. I'm gonna throw down what I got in my head and you guys can pull it apart

Rebel Cap ships:

Corellian Gunship------same in books

Corellian Corvette-----same

Bulk Cruiser------------MC80 Liberty Class

Nebulon frigate---------same in books

Assault frigate----------same in books

Dreadnaught-----------MC40a

Carrier-----------------Bulk Cruiser Refitted to carriers during trilogy

CC7700----------------Peregrine Class Modified Strike Cruiser

CC9900----------------????

MC80-------------------Republic Star Destroyer Black fleet Crisis

Liberator---------------Nebula Star Destroyer 11 years after Endor

Dauntless--------------MC80b Mon Remonda

Bulwark----------------MC90 Defiant

Medium transport-----same

Action IV---------------YT1300 or similar

 

Imp Cap Ships

Lancer-----------------same

Strike------------------same

Carrack----------------same

Escort Carrier---------same

Dread------------------Katana Fleet Dreadnaught

Interdicter-------------Dominator Class Star Destroyer

VSD I------------------maybe change?

VSD II-----------------same

ISD I-------------------maybe change

ISD II------------------same

SSD--------------------same

Star Galleon-----------same

Galleon-----------------like to drop, modular star hauler maybe?

Assault transport------Shuttle or similar

Death Star-------------probably have to leave this where it is.

 

thats whats in my head anyways, basically most of its untouched, just redone. Dropping one of the isd and vsd variants would open a slot but I'm not sure what could go in their place. Gimme your thoughts anyways and we see what we end up with. i had an idea of putting Sluis van and bilbringi in 2 of the slots but not sure how that'll work out. Oh and Fighters CAN be changed too thanks to vakundok but the ones in there seem most appropriate to the timescale anyways.

Edited December 30, 2002 by Gank

[ElvisMiggell]

Well, i'd say look in the other forum, and also, let's be ambitious, we can change so much now, we can make this look really, really good.

[Gank]

I know theres a shiplist in the other forum but as this is the forum where it should be I'd like to start a new one here. The thread in the cards forum is a bit cluttered to follow properly, here I can edit my post so anyone who wants to try a model can see clearly what ones we're going to need. And we are changing a lot, every model is going to be different but personally I'd rather see good looking classic SW ships then a hodge podge of ships from all over the place.

[Tsunami]

I'll just re-post my list from the other thread since I am still thinking along these lines.

 

 

Posted: Fri Dec 27, 2002 5:26 pm Post subject:

 

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If we get rid of the older ships, we simply don't have enough!

My first idea was to get rid of the ISD I and VSD I, but I could not find enough ships to boot.

Right now, my list looks as follows:

 

MC-80a - ISD II

Assault Frigate - VSD II

MC-40 - Carrack

Corellian Gunship - Lancer Frigate

Quasar Fire Carrier - Imperial Escort Carrier

YT1300 - Delta DX/Lambda/Sentinel

A-Wing - TIE Interceptor

B-Wing - TIE Bomber

---Research starts here---

Modified Corvette - Modified Corvette

Marauder - Interdictor

Modified Frigate - Modified Frigate

Katana Dreadnaught - Katana Dreadnaught

Modified Strike Cruiser - Strike Cruiser

MC-80b - SSD

Bulk Transport - Bulk Transport

X-Wing - Allegiance ISD

MC-90 - Scimitar

E-Wing - Eidolon Class Strike Cruiser

Dominator - Dominator ISD

Bothan Assault Cruiser - Nemesis ISD

Viscount Star Defender - Sovereign SSD

 

The Dominator is just like an ISD II equiped with gravity well projectors.

The Nemesis ISD is a ship made up by the guys at the NJO Project, but it looks really authentic and has a great model. They also have models for Mediator and Bothan Assault Cruisers and the Star Defender.

All ships except for the Nemesis are authentic and appeared in books, comics or games. Except for the Allegiance, there is a model available for every one of them.

 

(actually, I somehow missed the TIE Defender up there. The Marauder is more like a placeholder at the current state.)

[Gank]

The NJO ships dont really fit with the timeline, they're a good 20 years ahead of what we're basing this one. And while Terribly Mauled and Sean Bs models are very nice bear in mind they're made for Xwa and have a much higher polycount then what we're aiming for here. Same goes for JMs Dominator. Please remember that while their maybe models for every ship you mention that we have a polylimit of 2k and most of the models out there are higher than this, apart from the xwa ones. Also we cant go round ripping off models left right and centre, its considered bad form and can land us in trouble.

 

As for the rest I like the idea of the Allegience, fits in with the timeline and theres also a vsd like version iirc. I'm not familiar with the eidolon though, do you have any links to a pic or model? Personally I'd rather see the stock corvette and frigate in their rather than the modified versions, its more canon. I dont really like the idea of 2 ints on each side, nor the imps using a bulk transport as they've got a good few specialised Imp only transports.

[ElvisMiggell]

Well, i''ve had games last over 20 years by my reckoning, okay so research doesn't happen all the way through, it tends to happen at the start, but do you really want to play with most of the same ships from before?

 

I thought that Mask had found a way to reduce the poly count?

 

We're not going to rip off models, we're going to ask if we can use them, and fully credit all our sources.

 

Would you define canon, i'm begining to see a problem here. Lots of people say, oh this is canon, or this isn't. Do you mean canon as in what appeared in the films, which Lucas wrote. Do you mean canon from the books, which Lucas approved? Or do you mean canon from the computer games which Lucas also approved? Or canon from the West End Games source books, which Lucas approved? Or is there another source that you mean?

[Gank]

I want to play with the ships that actually fought in the thrawn trilogy, not ones that appeared 20 years down the road. If the tc was set in the njo period and people wanted to included trade federation ships I'd be against that too. I've no problem with changing all the ships but most of the ships in the original line up are the ones that are mentioned in the thrawn trilogy books

 

I have a number of poly chopping programs on my hd but reducing a 20k model to 2k is not as simple as it sounds. Most of the time your left with gaping mesh holes and polygons stretching off to infinity. They're simply not designed to cut things down that much.

 

Fair enough on the asking permissions but its the first I've heard it mentioned and I was under the impression that we would be making the models ourselves, at least thats what I understood when jediigor asked me to take charge of the modelling part.

 

What I meant by canon, quite simple: the Corellian Corvette and Nebulon B Frigate were in the films and the modified versions were not.

[Guest JediIgor]

Well, I'm not against using ships that were in the Thrawn period, but some of the older ships weren't (or didn't play a big role).

 

Plus, I think the player would be much more interested in playing if he got to research ships, instead of just jumping head-on with everything researched.

[Gank]

Ok myself and Jedi Igor discussed the rebel side and came up with a few ideas, modified the list above. Thoughts please.

[ElvisMiggell]

Okay, the Rebs side looks pretty good now, although i'm not sure what the Nebula SD looks like, is there a link anywhere?

 

I'd still like to see something on the Imp side that the Rebels simply cannot match on a one to one basis, so probably a Sovereign or an Eclipse class.

 

I always found it anoying that the Rebels had something to match the SSD in the original. I don't mind them matching the SSD now because an Mc90 can, but i still want somnething that's going to take at least a couple of Mc90's to take down, or 6 or so Mc80's.

[Gank]

MC90 take out an SSD? wtf? 90s a match for an ISD, SSD is the length of 11 ISDs. Gonna take a good few mon cals to knock one out. As for the Eclipse and Sov I wouldnt mind putting in one but the main strengths of these are their axial superlasers. Still they fit in with the timeline so I have no objections.

[Enternamehere]

If the SSD is made more to what are now known to be the specs, there is nothing in the Rebel fleet to match it. Look in Solo Command, it takes a huge force to attack the Iron Fist, and even then it escapes. Or the Bacta War, with the Lusankya. You can't really destroy a ship the size of a Super Star Destroyer anyways, just totally strip it down to a hulk, with the exception of an incident like the Executor crashing into the deathstar.

[ElvisMiggell]

I'm sorry Gank but you're wrong, I checked all my source books last night. Sansweet's encyclopaedia, the Star Wars technical journal, the Guide to ships and vehicles, and Dark Empire, all list an SSD as being 8000m long, = 8 kilometers = 5miles.

 

An ISD is 1600m long = 1.6kilometers = 1 mile = 5x smaller than an SSD

 

An Mc80a can match an ISD, it is slightly smaller, but has more concentrated weapons, and more shield, so it can last for longer.

 

An Mc80b, like the Mon Remonda, was able to give an SSD a run for its money when it had an Mc80a and a couple of smaller ships with it.

 

Therefore, an Mc90 must be at least a match for an SSD.

[Guest JediIgor]

If anyone knows whether the Rebels were building their own SSDs, we might think about adding that to our list.. otherwise, no.

 

You must also remember that the Empire's resources were all but unlimited; they built the SSDs to show off their power. The Rebels on the other hand, had to make-do with what they had (hence the converted luxury cruisers). While an MC90 may not necessarily be able to take on an SSD, 2 of them might, and the prices will probably be reflecting that as well.

[Gank]

Check out this page for SSD length http://www.theforce.net/swtc/ssd5mile.html but this has been debated over and over elsewhere so please dont start argueing about it here.

Anyways an Mc90 is 1200m long and no matter if the SSD is 8km, 12.7km or 17.6 km its still not going to beat it. Your logic doesnt make sense, the MC90 and MC80b were both the same size and were put in service at the same time, if an 80b could not defeat an SSD with the help of an 80a (same size but less advanced) then surely an MC90 is no match for an SSD? Anyways theres no way an 80b and 80a could take on a ship 6+1/2 times their size, it simply doesnt make sense.

[TK421]

We are going offtopic again

[Trejiuvanat]

What's the final list then?

[Guest Pucho777]

RESIGNED!!! REMOVE ACCOUNT!!! Edited September 6, 2003 by Pucho777

[ElvisMiggell]

Don't quote me numbers, otherwise 'll quote you others from another source that are different.

 

Anyway. I'm going to compromise on this. Well, just defer to a higher authority actually. Igor, you decide. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, so long as what we end up with is relatively balenced.

 

[Guest Pucho777]

RESIGNED!!! REMOVE ACCOUNT!!! Edited September 6, 2003 by Pucho777

[Guest JediIgor]

Are we talking about Super Star Destroyers vs MC90as here?

 

Like Elvis said, as long as it's balanced, that's what really matters .

[deXtoRious]

Somewhere in the first page someone mentioned some "other sites" and an NJO project. Could you people please give me links to their websites (I'm a newbie in Rebellion modifying)?

[deXtoRious]

One more thing. I am more than willing to convert models for this project, but I need help on using LithUnwrap. I need to know how to reduce the polygon count in LithUnwrap, for example I have a great Eclipse II model, but it has ~10000 polygons

[the_mask]

Without any specific other 3D editing software it boils down to deleting litlle 'extras' that look nice, but don'T serve any real purpose for the ship.

With the Eclipse I had to delete numerous little claw-like things around the engines, for example, that reduce a lot... among other things. If you use any automatic reduction tool, be sure that you don't end up with holes in your model

[Tsunami]

deXtoRious: The XWA NJO-Project site is at http://njoproject.skywalkeronline.net

 

Maybe some ships like the Mediator, Viscount or Bothan Assault Cruiser won't be in the TC, but I would REALLY appreciate if someone converted their models for Rebellion.