Alien Life

[Darth_Rob]

Just out of curiosity (seeing how we are all devoted scifi fans), who believes that there is other life in the universe, in other galaxies and the like?

[Cain]

Nope no aliens out there - in my opinion

 

 

We are the first aliens that will colonise the universe.

[DarthTex]

There's gotta be intelligent life out there somewhere. It sure isn't here on this planet .

[Darth_Rob]

I also believe that there is other life out there. I feel that it is nieve to think that we can be the only planet in the universe capable of supporting intelligent life.

[Grand_Admiral_Thrawn]

I think you will find that many of hte responses here will tie in with the Religion thread (depending on how "hard-core" (sorry, I couln't think of a better term)).

 

I personally think it would be rather naive to think we are the only intellignet life in the universe. It would even be naive to think that we're the only intelligent life in our own galaxy.

 

Some people use the excuse "well, if they were out there we would have seen them by now". To that I ask, when was the last time you stopped and had a conversation with an ant or a ground hog?

[Darth_Rob]

That is a very good point. We are just peons to an advanced alien race that has mastered intergalatic travel, and just happened to pass us over. In fact, wasn't that how "First Contact" in the Star Trek universe was? That if a human hadn't mastered rocket science, then the Romulans (the big eared guys, I think) would have passed the earth over, thinking it inferior and unworthy?

[Mad78]

Of course we are not alone.

It is stupid to think we are for it is simple fact that we can't be.

[Jahled]

Statistically, we cannot be alone, unless you are a blinkered fool who assumes the human-race is somehow the most sacred and ultimate piece of art produced by the atom and the centre of what is utterly fathomless. The universe is beyond vast.

 

The human race is never going to reach the end of our solar system without the injection of the fantastic and ultimately impossible physics. Sorry guys, but we've figured out enough of the fundermental laws and basics of the universe to know more or less where we stand and what is realistically achievable. Faster than light travel; or any convinient 'short cuts' aren't. One of the modern era's glorys is the understanding of what seperates pure-fantasy, and hard coded science. If the human race can ever be bothered to make the extremely boring and slow journey to Pluto I doubt it will open any Champaign. Nothing but rock and ice, no gravity to get out the snowboards, and the realization we've got another 70,000/1th to go before we get to the end of our own solor system.

 

Hopefully, long before we're that bored to even contemplate such a venture, we will have stopped taking the ability to think that seriously.

 

A few pathetic points:

 

Where are the aliens? They have had plenty of time to get here. Space should be awash with the same cosmic media we've been blasting into it in the last century, even from a distance. Aliens have had about a couple of hundred million years head start on our evolution, so where is it?

 

Faster than light travel. Where are the time travellers? Again, a couple of hundred million years to get here, and do more than sneak around rural Dakota scaring people on their own in a car. Given faster than light travel would essentially be time travel, where are our peers from the future? They have, as I have pointed out in the past, have had plenty of 'time' to get here.

[DarthTex]

Darth_Rob wrote:

 

In fact, wasn't that how "First Contact" in the Star Trek universe was? That if a human hadn't mastered rocket science, then the Romulans (the big eared guys, I think) would have passed the earth over, thinking it inferior and unworthy?

 

They were Vulcans , and you got it.

 

 

Jahled wrote:

 

Where are the aliens? They have had plenty of time to get here.

 

 

Just a question we all can relate to: if playing rebellion with the largest galaxy setting, how often do you check on all of the systems in the outer rim? Once for sure, maybe twice later on to colonize or look for someone/something. Now, add a couple of billion more systems to check (that would be a heck of a game! ).

 

Now the latest estimate is the universe is approximately 15 billion years (Billion with a B) old. Let's say it takes 14 billion years for some other life out there to develop and "travel" the universe. The "aliens" have had a billion years to find us. The best way to "detect" intelligence is via radio waves (hence SETI), which are the only things humans can currently use to get out of our solar system. Let's say radio signals have been going out from Earth for about 100 years. If the "aliens" are walking along a mile (1.6 km) long path (the path represents their time looking for us), they're looking for a "signal" that's about 6/1,000 ths of inch (0.16 mm) long (which is smaller than a human hair). The time frame that "intelligent" life has been "signalling" on this planet is literally shorter than a blink of the eye compared to the age of the universe. Maybe they've already looked this rock over (who knows how many times), and might come back later when we're "more evolved"? Only human arrogance thinks they should contact us "now".

 

Maybe our "solar system" is actually a big "cage" in the inter-galactic zoo, so all the different "aliens" can "watch" us.

 

 

Grand_Admiral_Thrawn wrote:

 

... when was the last time you stopped and had a conversation with an ant or a ground hog?

 

I remember a similar thing said on the scifi Babylon 5 series (they did mention the ant).

[Thrawn90]

Perhaps in the future, human life will evolve on its own to the point where we have mastered faster-than-light space travel, and the like. But until then, we cannot be interfeared with, less our evolution be disturbed

 

 

...Or not.

[DarthTofu]

Well, for one thing we don't know if alien life out there is just at about the same technology level as us, trying to get to their own moon, or something like that. And by the way, Jahled, I think I have a shortcut that you failed to mention- black holes and white holes. Sure you would be sucked in, curshed in the singularity to something the aproximate size of an atom, spat out, sucked back in, and obliterated, but you still might get to another point int he universe for 1 quagillionth of a second!

[AdmiralToguroAni]

During the 1996 US Presidential campaign I remember there being some media hype about fossils of one-celled organisms existing on the moon. Unless they've found that to be false, we can at least assume that there is rudimentary life on other planets, even if it IS as small as bacteria. As for intelligent life, it makes sense for there to be life, but perhaps since physics won't allow us to go too far out into space, we're all confined on our own planets, constantly wondering whether we're alone.

[Mad78]

Maybe our "solar system" is actually a big "cage" in the inter-galactic zoo, so all the different "aliens" can "watch" us.

Like a kind of Intergalactic reality TV show. ***smiles to the sky***

we're all confined on our own planets, constantly wondering whether we're alone.

We know we aren't. We are just terribly curious as to what the other aliens look like.

[Darth_Rob]

And there is no freakin way of even guessing. Every alien race would look different based upon the environmental factors of the home planet (atmospheric composition, abundance of certain elements, etc).

[Grand_Admiral_Thrawn]

During the 1996 US Presidential campaign I remember there being some media hype about fossils of one-celled organisms existing on the moon. Unless they've found that to be false, we can at least assume that there is rudimentary life on other planets...

 

Well, there is a small problem with that. it is now generally accepted that the moon was created when another astral body of substantial size collided with the earth realy on. Any fossils found on the moon could be transfer from earth.

 

At the present time we do not have, and cannont fathom, the technology needed to break the boundry of our own solar system. This does not mean that it's not possible. Remember, two hundred years ago humanity couldn't have even imagined a combustion engine or a computer, and yet today almost every one in the developed world has one or the other. There will most likely be forms of technology we can create with the most creative flights of imagination right now.

 

Also consider that the most prominent pieces of information used in modern physics are still called theories. The M Theory, the Theory of relativity (though modified form it's original state), the String Theory. Our current knowledge works well on its own (that is, each theory works when used on it's own), but when you try and combine each theory together everything breaks down.

 

It should also be recognised that we may not have advnaced enough technology to communicate with, or to recieve communications from, alien life. Sure, as far as we know radio waves are the best form of communication, but what if some other race knows better? If you were in a forest and heard a thumping sound in the distance, would you know that it's a native drummer inviting you to dinner? We humans really do think highly of ourselves. We tend to think that "Well, if we can't do it it's not possible". This might be our biggest limiting feature.

[Jahled]

During the 1996 US Presidential campaign I remember there being some media hype about fossils of one-celled organisms existing on the moon. Unless they've found that to be false, we can at least assume that there is rudimentary life on other planets...

 

Well, there is a small problem with that. it is now generally accepted that the moon was created when another astral body of substantial size collided with the earth realy on. Any fossils found on the moon could be transfer from earth.

 

At the present time we do not have, and cannont fathom, the technology needed to break the boundry of our own solar system. This does not mean that it's not possible. Remember, two hundred years ago humanity couldn't have even imagined a combustion engine or a computer, and yet today almost every one in the developed world has one or the other. There will most likely be forms of technology we can create with the most creative flights of imagination right now.

 

Also consider that the most prominent pieces of information used in modern physics are still called theories. The M Theory, the Theory of relativity (though modified form it's original state), the String Theory. Our current knowledge works well on its own (that is, each theory works when used on it's own), but when you try and combine each theory together everything breaks down.

 

It should also be recognised that we may not have advnaced enough technology to communicate with, or to recieve communications from, alien life. Sure, as far as we know radio waves are the best form of communication, but what if some other race knows better? If you were in a forest and heard a thumping sound in the distance, would you know that it's a native drummer inviting you to dinner? We humans really do think highly of ourselves. We tend to think that "Well, if we can't do it it's not possible". This might be our biggest limiting feature.

 

What you overlook, dude, is that what we can fathom is what the laws of the universe dictate as are possible and what are utlimately completely unachievable with the laws of the Universe. Whilst it's obvious to put forward the argument that we, as humanity, may be at that stage where incredibly advanced technology is beyond present conception; this is a stance that overlooks some fundermental realities that have been discovered in modern times that have had proven results in research and consequenctial results. Those clever scientists have figured out the age of stars; our own sun, our planet, the evolution of the human race; etc, and the mysterious mathematical zero at the core of black holes when their matter simply drops out of the universe altogether, and becomes unknowable.

 

Their clever mathematics have also indicated that due to the age of even our own galaxy, the proportion of planets, etc, should yield a sky filled with detectable signs of media acivity. Three hundred million years is an extremely conservitive threshold. But silence. Drums in the jungle is not appropriate here, nothing has been detected without any alien reason to remain so obscure or esoteric. At the least, if you are advanced enough to smash the laws of physics you are advanced enough enough to communicate...

[Evaders99]

Of course if you had the technology, and never want to communicate, you wouldn't have to. Non-intervention policy?

 

- Side-topic

 

Actually... according to the Giant Impact Theory, the moon would have been created during a collision with a semi-molten Earth. This is figured around 4.5 Billion years ago, shortly after the formation of the Earth. The surface of the Earth was cool enough to form a crust around 4.1 Billion years ago. Life is started around 4.0 Billion years ago with self-reproducing RNA molecules.

No fossils would have been around during the formation of the moon. In fact, no life at all. Boned animals would not have come around until 505 Million years ago.. the appearance of the first verbebrates - fish.

 

- End side-topic

[DarthTofu]

I would like to direct everyone's attnetion to exhibit A: Roswell, in which we made first contact with aliens life! (Runs around screaming and high on life). Okay, now that that's over, I have to agree with Thrawn. There are ways that we could travel to other galaxies, we just don't know them. What if, to steal from my favorite show a certain concept, we manage to find some method through which we can take our bodies, take them down to atoms, send them through wormholes and somehow recover them? We have a new galaxy to explore. And I think we're also forgetting the space probes that have been sent out- while obsolete, there is every possibility that they will some day encounter an alien life long after we have forgotten about them and send us back information.

[Darth_Rob]

For one thing, I don't entirely believe in the whole Roswell conspiracy theory. It's just a load of bull that "true believers" swear to. Its their bit of "evidence" they need in order to "believe". But I do believe that there are other galaxies out there. We just have to discover the way to get to them.

[Mad78]

For one thing, I don't entirely believe in the whole Roswell conspiracy theory. It's just a load of bull that "true believers" swear to. Its their bit of "evidence" they need in order to "believe". But I do believe that there are other galaxies out there. We just have to discover the way to get to them.

Well said.

 

I guess it will still take quite some time before we can go on a skiing holiday on pluto before going and having lunch on Mars. But surely in a few hundred years intersystem travel could be possible.

And btw NASA are thinking of the first Mars mission for 2030.

[DarthTofu]

And I shall commandeer the craft for the mission and go there first! Or something like it. HOw funny would it be if Russia got to Mars before us? As for Roswell haters... Yeah, I guess I have to agree with you there, but there have been some weird unexplained phenomenan concerning aliens, such as in the mid 1900s a UFO was sited over Paris. When two fighter planes went up to check it out, both experianced the same failure at the same time for unidentified reasons. Just saying, there is some stuff that has yet to be explained.

[Defender_16]

HOw funny would it be if Russia got to Mars before us?

 

Russia doesn't have the economy for it, China on the other hand has an up and coming space program. With a moon shot planned sometime before 2020. The US could get to Mars by 2016 if they put that as a priority but they won't. 2018 is my earliest guess.

 

(Yeah I know, kind of off topic.)

[DarthTofu]

No, remember, we lost the space race with Russia but we made it to the moon before them- that's why it would be funny. There's irony there. We now return to our regularly scheduled topic.

[Darth_Rob]

I definetly think that NASA should get a higher priority when it comes to funding. Space travel is going to be pivitol in the future. Every year, the Earth's population rises. Eventually, we're going to get prett cramped. We're going to need to start colonizing unsettled planets and making them capable of supporting human life for colonists. Also, since I do believe in the existence of extraterristial life, I also believe in the possibility that they could be hostile, and plan an invasion. NASA has to have some space craft developed that can prove worthy in battle, because a rocket ship is not gonna cut the mustard when faced with an alien death ray...

[DarthTofu]

Uh, dude, let's face it- we aren't about to get attacked by some psycho aliens with Death Rays. Independance Day was a Science Fiction movie. And we do have a population limit solution: Canabalism. Just take someone you hate and eat them, then the world's population goes down and world hunger is also ended. Hey, why is everyone coming at me with a fork? Guys? Guys?