Balance and ideas

[Evaders99]

http://www.swrebellion.com/evillejedi/faq.php#sub3

[Ferigad]

For me it will be forever Shield Generator´s

[Admiral-Ackbar]

Im sorry, its just that it really appears in the movie that the domes are the shield generators, where it really is the big lump at the bottom of the ship.

[bobandrubert]

They are sheild domes. I have read lots of books about this kind of stuff. and acctully shields don't hug the ship.

[Krytos]

Yeah, the two domes on top of a Star Destroyer are the shield gens - it's just in most games they've made them WAY to easy to destroy *cough* XVT *cough*. The comm tower is between the shield generators.

 

And the dome underneath the Star Destroyer is from the Ionization reactor inside the ship

[Cain]

Ideeas & Feedback :

 

 

1. The fighters are to many

 

2. They are to small and flik to much .....I know they are ok in SW size but.....Usualy in H2 from time to time I admired the fighters.

 

3. In a big battle the chaos is imense I can't make 100% control over it

 

 

4. The numbers of shots must be reduced.

 

 

5. Smoke in space ?!....loll....you should consider darkening the hull or make more hull-scars appear etc.

 

 

6. I know that this way you makeit SW original but make a version for difficulty, quality and art.

 

 

7. Some ships are to dark they don't show....put more gamma in theyr textures.

 

 

8. The game is to easy both sides 0.26c)

 

 

9. All other aspects are very good

 

 

10. PS....not all engines have glow when moveing

[Admiral-Ackbar]

An issue with turning on reasearch- It takes the computer about 45 min to build up to the basic frigate level, Even with resource injections! by this time my armada of heavy destroyers has oblitterated all but one computer and is hyperspacing around looking for the last one....ie stalling for a more challanging fight... PLEASE fix this issue asap.

[Admiral-Ackbar]

HAHAHA, my bad, the domes on the top are indeed projectors, but not the only ones... sorry if I confused anybody

[EvilleJedi]

I know I'm going against hundreds of published works, but as far as I care the domes are sensors. go read the star wars technical commentaries if you want to find out why. I will not change this regardless of any other information (same goes with the executors true length) I am IGNORING the official sources because they have propogated lies to you all

 

the bump on the bottom is the main reactor.

 

AI is stlll being worked out, this is all new code and it takes a lot of work to get the AI to even function at all.

 

the issue about fleet control is actually a problem with HW2 in general. Relic tried to make the game have less micromanagment by implementing the strikegroup options, unfortunately this doesn't work right

really how you should play the game is to

 

1. build a fleet

2. hot key capital ships or special ships to numbers

3. assign guarding ships to the capitals

4. set the stances for groups of ships in the fleet

5. select the whole fleet and assign it to a strike group

 

6. during battles only select the hotkeyed ships to attack (their support ships will behave appropriately depending on their stances) DO NOT band box select them and attack as this turns off their guarding roles. (concentrating fire on one ship basically ruins fleet organization)

 

if you do this then the battles will be a lot cleaner and easier to control, it's a shame relic didn't make the interface better in this regard, this is a really powerful feature that basically gets trashed because of the 'select a whole fleet and tell it to attack one ship' gameplay style.

 

the issue of laser fire is also agian a lie perpetrated by the previous games (xiwng/ tie) most capital ships have hundreds of weapons that can fire once every 10-20 seconds, this is what battles SHOULD look like(xwing tie showed capital ships firing maybe 5% of their guns even during capital ship battles) the lag is caused by unoptimized effects and should be reduced in future versions.

 

I have no clue what this means

" know that this way you makeit SW original but make a version for difficulty, quality and art."

are you saying make a special version that isn't starwars?

 

I'm thinking with the smoke I ill turn off the rising effect, it should just disperse into space, but I mean we have sound effects, it's nice to have visual feedback on the ships condition (battlescars are perfromance problems)

 

engine glows are because of unfinished work, be patient.

[Cain]

Just an ideea the zip file is not very attractive ....try useing the SFX rar option and insert your own comments .ico etc.

 

 

You may want to see the PTESB for an ideea ......I've costumized my download file.....

 

 

About the smoke well the H2 has smoke I've double cheked now.....hmmm I have no ideea how to change this but smoke in space gliding up slowly.....it is virtualy impposible....and if we are going for visual effects....well make the fighters a little bigger ... the squadrons smaller....etc.

[Nath]

First, I'd like to express my pleasure at having played/tested the Starwars Warlords Mod for Homeworld 2. EvilleJedi, as well as all who have aided him rock! However there is ONE major point that really needs to be discussed. That point is the maximum playable map size

 

I'll keep this short and simple. Those who are working on this project are SERIOUSLY limiting the playability of this Starwars Mod. With a modern computer and a gig or more of RAM, a Homeworld 2 map can be truely massive. I've made a map (as a simple test) that was a 1000 kilometers across without any slowdown. It was hard to navigate, but it can be done. In fact, I think I could have made a much larger map then even that.

 

What really limits the playability of a map that big is not so much the size, but all the crap that map/ship designers put into their designs. We've all played Homeworld 2 missions that quickly slow down as the debris piles up. If the ship designers simply remove all debris spawning from their ships, and the map designers remove all spinning wreckage/resources, you suddenly have the ability to play on COLOSAL sized maps without ANY slowdown.

 

The ship sizes and costs in the Starwars Warlords mod, as well as the cheap hyperspace costs, all point to the need of truely massive maps in order to attain the grand fleet combat experience I think the designers want. This can be easily done if the designers are willing to simply remove debris spawning and spinning map wreckage. To not do so will reduce the Starwars Mods fleet engagements to nose to nose slugfests. Harly worthy of all you aspiring Grand Admiral Thrawns out there.

 

This is the third post of this reply within this forum. Sorry if that irritates some of you guys, but I really feel strongly about expressing this point to the forum readers. Thanks.

[Krytos]

Yeah, I think we can see how strongly you feel about it

 

But I do agree with the problem of map sizes. I find I only really play the larger maps other wise the battles become early slug fests where the side that can throw out us many units as fast as possible will be the victor - no real strategy. A large size map would allow for so much more, as with the larger maps in the game it allows players to build up individiual tasks forces and to attack from mulitple directions, allow a real use for picket ships etc. However, perhaps there would be a better way of allowing these larger maps than completely removing the debris - after all it adds an extra element of stratgey of owning the battle field for collecting resources . . . and well, it just looks plane old cool

 

Personally, I could live with a really big grin on my face with Warlords as it is - lets face it it's awesome - though, I wouldn't mind some of these larger maps.

[Maalek]

Well I played a few games against the cpu and have to say, that if I play the empire, I always win and if I play the Alliance I always loose.

This shouldnt be the lack of skill, but more that the Imperial ISD`s have in my opinion far too much firepower. For example the Imperator II Destroyer has on both sides these laser-turrets which fire all 10 seconds a HEAVY turbo-laser-salvo. Do this with 2 destroyers and you can beat any Alliance cruiser in 2 salvos.

 

How would the mod be if you terminate theese turrets and let the destroyers fight only with their other weapons. Then giv all cap-ships a little bit more hitpoints and its done. I think this would be an interesting balance improoval.

 

I am no expert and do not know the technical-notes about the sw-ships, but would this be a way to improove these genius mod??

[Krytos]

The Alliance, pre-Dark Empire era, should really concentrate on hit and run style tactics - use fighters to destroy Imperial Refinery ships, jump fleets in for a quick strike and then jump out before you are over powered, string the enemy out over a long distance and stop them mounting any real defence, use fighters and their salvo ability on capitals and wear down the enemy before launching a primary strike. Make sure that your fleet is filled up not only with capitals, but plenty of support ships - such as Corellian Gunships, frigates etc. (Nebulon-Bs are great because they are so cheap for a frigate, which allows you to build them up quick early on in the game).

 

If you play pre-NJO/no restrictions, then you needn't just play like this, the New Republic has Defender class Star Destroyers, MC90s, Mediator class Battlecruisers which are all exellent warships which can stand up against an Imperial onslaught. At the moment the DSD doesn't have shields, so it isn't as strong as it will be, though it can deal out a lot of damage. The MC90 is a great alrounder capable of effect defencive/offencive manouvers against both fighters and capitals, with the Mediator more or less being a bigger and better version.

 

When the next version of the mod come out the New Republic will also be able to produce Strident class Star Defenders, which are very powerful, very large warships (New Republics equivalent of an SSD). There will also be the Republic class Star Destroyer, a powered down version of the Defender. Eventually the New Republic wil get other capitals like the Bothan Assault cruiser and Majestic class Cruiser and support craft like Warrior class Gunships and Sacheen . . . *drooling mouth* Man I love this mod

[Maalek]

Interesting, where did you get those infos?

And could it be possible, that the AI lacks on some maps and on others dont?

The most time the AI only builds ships and dont send them aways, except of some fighters and some frigates and corvettes. The capitals hold still all along at the shipyards. And the AI dont use hyperspace.

 

If there are maps you can propose I would be glad.

[Krytos]

I basically thought of how the Rebels attacked in the movies and other games and implemented into this game based off the units each side has. In a nut shell, play to the teams advantage - Imps = big firepower, Rebels = good fighters/bombers and sneak tactics (Longprobe's Probe and Bulk transport's ECM). The New Republic is a good mix between these two extremes, so it's a comprimise between tactics.

 

As for the AI, I've noticed that the enemy keeps their Destroyers and cruisers at their base as well - results in a large blood bath during the final battle (generally I only loose 1 or two capitals, though a lot of support vessels and fighters). If it gets annoying you can bait the AI. Cruisers aren't very good at hitting fighters, so jump in a squadron of fast fighters near an enemy capital. Get the cruiser to attack the fighters and slowly fly away towards your base and they should follow the fighters - for a while, then the ship will stop when the fighters get too far away, so keep them in firing range of the ship (if there are fighters or frigates near by that engage you, jump your force out of there or they'll be destroyed). This tactic works best against ISD Mk IIs, Allegiances and other ships suited for capital battles.

The other thing I've noticed is to have your main protective force between the enemy base and your refinery ship - as they'll try to attack the refinery ship nearly everytime - nearly.

[Maalek]

Thx, you spoke of ECM, what is that? an Anti-Missile-System?? For what is an ecm-probe good for? And you mentioned the torpedo-salvo capability earlier. use fighers this automatically? cause I cant find the button in the special-command-screen. Have the fighters to dock an a carrier to reload the salvos or do they have "limitless" torpedos? And what is a picket-ship?

I didnt find anyting about ship-description at the warlords homepage.

[bobandrubert]

Electric counter muesure. I guess it is like anti rader but I never use it. No they use some but use the z key to use all (got to love the b-wing salvo 72 missiles! ) and yes they need to reload. I don't now what you mean by pickit ship but I think they are frigates. http://warlords.swrebellion.com/statbrowser/

 

 

Closeest thing to discription.

[Krytos]

ECM - Electronic Counter Measures. In the game it basically blokes enemy sensors from seeing your units within the range of the ECM. An ECM probe is to counter this, to see through the ECM and detect units trying to hide.

 

The Torpedo-salvo is not automatically used, select a fighter (Note: Not all fighters have salvo capabilites, such as the Skipray) and press z. Put the cursor over the enemy ship and you'll see that the target cursor looks different. Click as if you would when you normally attack and when the fighters/bombers get in range instead of firing one or two warheads, they launch a massive salvo. The warheads in the game aren't limitless, and warhead salvos are limited (it varies on fighter). You'll need to dock with a carrier, cruiser or space station to re-arm and also repair fighter squadrons (if you lost fighters from a squadron, after they've finished docking there will be new fighters in the squadron).

 

Picket ships are small and fast. They're disigned to be a form of permiter gaurd and use sesors to detect enemies. Basically have them spread out beyond your front line to detect incoming enemies (personally I use Longprobes or Ferrits). They're not strong or powerful, though they are small and nimble - believe it or not, but I used them to destroy an Executor class SSD when my fleet of Rebel warships was wiped out.

[Maalek]

Ok, I applied new tactics and it worked. But what I always see is, that big capital ships have trouble to hit enemy installations as fighter-, destroyer- and cruiser shipyards. Much of the laser-fire flew right through the installation and didnt make any damage. Is this a known feature in the MOD to prevent the installations to be destroyed too fast? I also recognised, that the alliance destr&cruis ships, have like the empire a fire rythm. Looks like this: 1-1-2-1-1-2-1-1-2-

1 stands for regular fire and 2 for a high concentration of fire. I mentioned it above that in my opinon the MOD would have longer and more interesting battles without this "high-energy-salvo" from cap-ships. If I remember on games like Xwing vs TieFighter the battles took very long when cap-ships battles each other. How do you others think about that?

[Grand_Admiral_Pellaeon]

Yeah i noticed that patern as well, especialy when being the rebels vs the imperials. I would have my mc-90 cruisers fighting imp star destroyers and then suddenly the star destroyers would practicaly annihilate my shield. On X-Wing alliance it use to take ages (like ya said) for even an imperial star destroyer to take down an mc 80

[Grand_Admiral_Thrawn]

I think that the firing patter is due to something in the original game. The best way to couteract it is to create a more ballanced fleet. Build ships to take out the ISDs.

[lina]

Hi hi.

Firstly, Id just like to thank everyone who tried to help me getting this running cause its like..... uber coolioiscious. I just gave it a good test drive today and I love the ship models. Ive always been fond of naval battles and SW is one of my favorite naval universes. My brother came over today and we played it... all day and we came to many of the same conclusions.

 

A) Lag needs addressed. I know that its being worked on, but im just wanting to reiterate... i had 7 ISDs and them firing was causeing immense lag, and i have 1.5 gig of DDR ram, and a GF 4 vid card.

 

B) It would be nice to be able to zoom in a bit more because the fighter craft are pretty... The models are wasted if ya can only get a dim glimpse of them when ya turn the camera angle just right. Otherwise they are just dots.

 

C) There is a bug inside the research screen. I would be researching something, and if the game didnt like what i was researching, it wouldnt research it till it was good and ready. This was very anoying. I ended up turning research and resourcing off and made injections of 5k RUs every 10 seconds. It sped the game up a lot.

 

Those are my only complaints right now. I love this mod to pieces. Everything is simply wonderful and its all eye candy for a mad power hungry lass as myself. Oh, and btw.... the little blisters above the bridge... I thought they were shield generators also. And i thought they only covered the bridge, not the whole ship. Cause when i saw rebel fighters shooting the ISDs, i saw hull damage, not shield impacts in the movies. Lets face it, an ISD isnt a Galaxy class starship, hehe.

 

Oh, btw, i would LOVE to see more hull damage from laser fire. Im impressed with the hull damage as is cause the lighting is superb, but the damage disappears about 15 seconds later. Keep those sizzling chunks of steel there till its repaired, hehe.

 

Someone said something about a Babylon 5 mod.... can anyone tell me where I could find that? Is it as wonderful as this mod? If so, could someone give me a web address? The 4 universes i love most in the space combat genre are Robotech, SW, Babylon 5, and Star Trek: TNG. Id love to see more mods like this. The attention to detail is just so wonderful... words cant express my love for this mod.... I just simply love it!

 

Lina

[Maalek]

To A: Yes with all the laser-fire and lightning effects, it could be really laggy if you play mp with a huge fleet, just each drop your resolution and only play with small fleet cap. (and who needs 7 ISD`s, lol)

 

To B: You can with holding Alt-key and doubleklick with your mouse on any spacecraft zoom very close on it.

 

To C: Dont know aboub that bug, but I disable resarch against the cpu, becaus its getting boring and eats much time. Against other human players it could be an option. The only "bug" I have in the research screen is, that the icons of different technologys have all the same look. And not much have a description, when you play Alliance, there are some Informations about the crafts in your building screen.

 

p.s. I LOVE the look of those Calamari B Destr. , good moddeling!!!

[bobandrubert]

every thime someone starts a warlords MP game I try to join it and it says you do not have this version of the game! Help.