New Planets!

[NovaCameron]

gah, added to first post......

[Lavo]

I think that the tax hits for some of the asteroids (ex. Comet, Asteroid) might be a bit much, even when considering the two pop techs. This isn't as much a problem with actual incomes as much as these hits will utterly cripple the AI, as they colonize anything they get their hands on. The Home upgrade (aka. moving capital) is absurdly priced as well. Also, I noticed that you changed the hyperspace radii from the SoGE standard, I'm going to have to change that back.

[NovaCameron]

For the radii, I might agree for I've noticed my fleets get split up for they always seem to exit on the edges. For the asteroids, do not put asteroids in, put roid belts in. Roids for the most part are tiny and useless. Even in the sw galaxy inhabited roids are very rare. Usually they are massive planetoids, not mile long habitats. As for moving your capital it may be a tad high but that's the point. It should not be easy to move it. I'll look at it and make it a bit more sane since i overestimated how much income you get.

 

There are very few 'colonizable' roids in our system: ceres, pluto, and the 3 or 4 new planetoids in the outer reaches. Think of this when you say they there should be tons of roids. Yes but only as belts or dead ones.

 

Edit: Do you realize the MASSIVE amount of credits that are in a given game? Even with the low and negative income planets barely make a dent in the income generated by centralized planets.

[Lavo]

There are very few 'colonizable' roids in our system: ceres, pluto, and the 3 or 4 new planetoids in the outer reaches. Think of this when you say they there should be tons of roids. Yes but only as belts or dead ones.

Actually, I don't say there should be tons of roids, just some. I'm really happy with the Random class you made, it has weighed out a very good ratio of planets:'roids.

 

As for moving your capital it may be a tad high but that's the point. It should not be easy to move it.

Agreed, but the costs you have range from 2-4 times as much as the cost of an SSD. This really is a bit much. :v

 

Edit: Do you realize the MASSIVE amount of credits that are in a given game? Even with the low and negative income planets barely make a dent in the income generated by centralized planets.

Like I said, I'm not concerned for human players, but this will likely cripple the AI early game, and the early game is when the major colonization happens. Though mind you, I'll play a few games first (I play with Insane AI), and report back my results after the first couple of hours worth of gameplay (might just spectate and let it run awhile to generate results).

[NovaCameron]

Ahhh! I see, my mistake, typo, 60k not 600K! lol I went and through and fixed them and halved all the prices. I made the Dead Asteroid uncolonizable because there really is no point to it and it would kill the AI with it's -5 cost i would put on it. Large Volcanic has been fixed. And redid the weightedrandom so there are less Asteroid Shipyards, than Asteroid and Comets, and much less of both compared to uncolonizable roids. This should provide some nice roid fields and dead roids (which are worthless) to fight over without killing the AI.

 

http://www.gamefront.com/files/20024414/patch.rar

[Lavo]

Ahhh! I see, my mistake, typo, 60k not 600K! lol I went and through and fixed them and halved all the prices. I made the Dead Asteroid uncolonizable because there really is no point to it and it would kill the AI with it's -5 cost i would put on it. Large Volcanic has been fixed. And redid the weightedrandom so there are less Asteroid Shipyards, than Asteroid and Comets, and much less of both compared to uncolonizable roids. This should provide some nice roid fields and dead roids (which are worthless) to fight over without killing the AI.

Did some games, slapped the Random values into the WeightedRandom one (which is what the Random generators use), and it's produced some really good results. The AI has one big dip early on, but this is due to the always generated Asteroid, which I have fixed by re-purposing the custom Asteroid doc I made to have an Asteroid which has a -1 underdev penalty. Thus it isn't enough to generate much, if any, income, but won't butcher the AI either. Not sure what I'll do in regards to the Random Ice/Volcanic, either will find a planet with a modest max pop (80-150 pre-tech) or get rid of it entirely. Adding the new files (bar the GalacticScenDef) now. Also, agreed on the DeadAsteroid bit, I didn't even include it in the old planets patch.

 

Edit: Switched up the Weighted Random values a bit. All of these Asteroids, and Storms, now have a 21.74% chance of spawning (lower than previous) in a WeightedRandom. http://www.sendspace.com/file/4dqlrr

[NovaCameron]

Actually replace the roid with a moon. You can't colonize those until tech lvl 7 with volcanic research. It also makes more sense to have a moon instead of a roid. mmm i like your random, which is good. But i think there should be more of the dead stuff. Point for adding storms and clouds.

 

Edit: oh, is that roid hardcoded? If it is i'll make a custom roid entity for it and make it a rocky moon....

 

Edit 2: http://www.gamefront.com/files/20024648/Roid+fix.rar

Roid fix hope this works...

[Lavo]

Actually replace the roid with a moon. You can't colonize those until tech lvl 7 with volcanic research. It also makes more sense to have a moon instead of a roid. mmm i like your random, which is good. But i think there should be more of the dead stuff. Point for adding storms and clouds.

 

Edit: oh, is that roid hardcoded? If it is i'll make a custom roid entity for it and make it a rocky moon....

 

Edit 2: http://www.gamefront.com/files/20024648/Roid+fix.rar

Roid fix hope this works...

Forgot to actually slap in my 'roid fix. So here's all the stuff for it: http://www.sendspace.com/file/vucc5t

 

Going to look at my WeightedRandom a bit, switch out some of the "alive" stuff for dead ones.

 

Edit: Reshuffled some stuff around, ratio is the same, however there is much less "alive" stuff (only 2 on the bottom now), the extra AsteriodShipyard have all been removed. http://www.sendspace.com/file/4jefx0

[NovaCameron]

Oh so that's how that works.... was wondering why it wasn't changing... You changed it in the updates you did. Ty! Now I'll go fix the random maps... lol

[Lavo]

Oh so that's how that works.... was wondering why it wasn't changing... You changed it in the updates you did. Ty! Now I'll go fix the random maps... lol

For some reason, the game is refusing to find my Asteroid fix (it's been re-entered into entity.manifest). I've tried both the original GalaxyScenDef entry and an attempted fix:

 

planetType
designName "AsteroidLavo"
designStringId "IDSGalaxyScenarioTypePlanetAsteroidLavo"
orbitBodyTypeCount 1
orbitBodyType "AsteroidLavo"

 

planetType
designName "AsteroidLavo"
designStringId "IDSGalaxyScenarioTypePlanetAsteroidLavo"
orbitBodyTypeCount 1
orbitBodyType "PlanetAsteroidLavo"

 

Perhaps you can shed some light on this?

[NovaCameron]

hmm oh did you add it back into the orbitBodyType list? I'm ripping apart the Random maps and remaking them... Hopefully to a better result. ^^

 

http://www.gamefront.com/files/20024957/Roid+fix+2.rar

 

Done. replaced roids with moons and replaced the IceVolcanic (which doesn't exist anymore) with the Tech 3 category which are nice planets to expand to.

 

This should be the end of the AIs problems.

[Lavo]

hmm oh did you add it back into the orbitBodyType list?

Nope, seems I didn't. Yeah, that should fix it.

 

Now as for the Random maps, I'm going to slap in the modded Asteroid for both, however, for the normal the Tech 3 category will remain, and the extra starting planets will have a volcanic or crystal moon (this is to replace the Random Ice/Volcanic). Seeing as how the extra planets bit is really just an addon I slapped in to speed up games, this shouldn't be an issue.

 

On another note, the Home costs are... Odd. Like the LowIndustrial costs twice as much as the Industrial, if anything it should be the other way around. Same thing happens with the High and Low Terran. Plus the HighTerran types have different Home costs. There's got to be a way to somehow streamline and sort/rank these. >_<

 

Edit: Oh and, I slapped in your RandomSmall map. Thanks for that, getting rid of some of the Randoms broke that map. Also, boosted the starting Population values on all the Random maps to coincide with the new (Low)Terran planet.

 

Edit 2: This is... Weird. It seems no matter what I do extra colonized planets (even when they are from a different file) are spawning with mines and factories. This doesn't happen with the current beta version. Maybe I should just scrap the maps altogether?

[NovaCameron]

They are ranked with Tech ranking. It is cheaper to put your capital for your galactic empire on a Ecumenopolis then a ice moon. Basically where you are doing is not 'colonizing' or 'improving' a planet, what you are doing is improving your faction's presence on a planet. Popcaps should be renamed, popular support, infrastructure for military presence, Exploration can be local planetary knowledge (which is why it is so cheap, for the most part, you can just bribe someone), Capital is actually your capital and the infrastructure that goes along with it, records, comms, politicians, propaganda to keep the pops happy for moving, ect. The space infrastructure are the systems on the planet that allow a faction to build, run, and maintain factories and defenses, comms and computers, which is why the crystal and metal costs are flipped. Thus it is cheaper to put them on a more populated, economic world. The worlds in the game will go on, faction or no faction.

 

Edit: Well you do have more levels so it would be good to boost the starting levels.

Not sure why they are starting with extra stuff... It's thinking that they are 'home' planets as well and giving them all the stuff. :/

 

Ooooooh i know why.... i gave all the planet setups a defaultHomePlanet template as well... by bad i'll go fix it...

 

http://www.gamefront.com/files/20025361/GalaxyScenarioDef.galaxyScenarioDef

here you go. all fixed. ^^

[Lavo]

They are ranked with Tech ranking. It is cheaper to put your capital for your galactic empire on a Ecumenopolis then a ice moon. Basically where you are doing is not 'colonizing' or 'improving' a planet, what you are doing is improving your faction's presence on a planet. Popcaps should be renamed, popular support, infrastructure for military presence, Exploration can be local planetary knowledge (which is why it is so cheap, for the most part, you can just bribe someone), Capital is actually your capital and the infrastructure that goes along with it, records, comms, politicians, propaganda to keep the pops happy for moving, ect. The space infrastructure are the systems on the planet that allow a faction to build, run, and maintain factories and defenses, comms and computers, which is why the crystal and metal costs are flipped. Thus it is cheaper to put them on a more populated, economic world. The worlds in the game will go on, faction or no faction.

Oh, I see. So "better" planets will be cheaper to move your capital to, due to the planet's population and industrial base?

 

Ooooooh i know why.... i gave all the planet setups a defaultHomePlanet template as well... by bad i'll go fix it...

So I don't mortally screw up my GalSceDef file, which I'll upload soon, which lines did you change?

 

And for those who want some eyecandy...

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/tropicalplanet2.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/dwarfurbanplanet.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/hugeforestplanet.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/comet.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/largehighterranplanet.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/pangeaplanet.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/rustyplanet.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/oceanplanet2.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/volcanicmoon.png

 

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/Lavo_02/SoGE/toxicplanet.png

 

 

Planet type and size is in the filename/url.

[NovaCameron]

umm a lot. just copy paste the entire template section you would be fine.

 

And yes, basically you will be using that planet's infrastructure to move your capital instead of having to build it all yourself. Basically everything will be cheaper on 'better' planets, planets that don't require special tech to run/occupy (lower colonization lvl) and the native infrastructure/tech lvl of that planet type.

 

(Yes, I might have over thought the planets when I was making them. )

 

TY for the images, I'm too lazy/busy to do them. lol

 

Edit: tomorrow I'll go through the planets up the pop growth based on tech lvl and 'propaganda' lvl, I'll even go though and rename the planet upgrades, and get rid of any reference to 'colonization'.

 

Edit 2: Oh and next to put back in some of the planet bonuses... rework those... *sigh*

 

Further in the future we can rework the tech trees for a more SW friendly environment. For after the planets that is really the last thing that needs changing.

[Evaders99]

WOW those images look great. Thanks for all the work, glad you guys are working together on this

[Lavo]

umm a lot. just copy paste the entire template section you would be fine.

That works.

 

And yes, basically you will be using that planet's infrastructure to move your capital instead of having to build it all yourself. Basically everything will be cheaper on 'better' planets, planets that don't require special tech to run/occupy (lower colonization lvl) and the native infrastructure/tech lvl of that planet type.

 

(Yes, I might have over thought the planets when I was making them. )

Nah, that isn't overthinking, that's just good planning.

 

Edit: tomorrow I'll go through the planets up the pop growth based on tech lvl and 'propaganda' lvl, I'll even go though and rename the planet upgrades, and get rid of any reference to 'colonization'.

Niiiiiiiiice.

 

Edit 2: Oh and next to put back in some of the planet bonuses... rework those... *sigh*

This actually isn't necessary, for the same reasons you yourself have said.

 

Further in the future we can rework the tech trees for a more SW friendly environment. For after the planets that is really the last thing that needs changing.

I'd be more than happy to help with the tech trees. The military tree is already fine as is (has faction-specific upgrades) and the defense tree will differ once stations are thrown in.

 

Here's the GalaxyScenDef file with the new template section: http://www.sendspace.com/file/uvn7w4

[NovaCameron]

Ya, I was thinking the economic tech tree could be expanded more... particularly the culture section.

[Lavo]

Ya, I was thinking the economic tech tree could be expanded more... particularly the culture section.

I wouldn't worry too much about the culture section, unless of course you are thinking of adding non-Broadcast Center related techs to it. As, in it's current form, culture is already extremely powerful. The econ tree might be worth reworking a bit... Though I'd say leaving it might be best as it works fairly well as is. The planetary section could definitely use some some reworking.

[NovaCameron]

Right right. I'm more trying to finish up The Conquests of Xim the Despot map. Then it's on to the Birth of the Republic and a larger galaxy map. I'll bring back my insane 1200 planet map later.

[Lavo]

That would lag the game just from the sheer volume of planets. :v

 

Also, Nova, would you agree that it's safe to say that, the planet mod is in a good enough state/beta/etc to be uploaded to the SVN? If so, I'll get around to clearing the Sins Plus stuff and then add your stuff to the SVN. Tis been a pleasure working with you on getting this to work with SoGE, I like your work ethic.

[NovaCameron]

Yup Yup. I'll fix the growth later and upload it with some maps.

[Lavo]

Yup Yup. I'll fix the growth later and upload it with some maps.

Sounds good. Also, before I upload, do you want your maps to have the weird default settings (that is, for a person's home planet), or have ones adjusted for the mod (aka. the ones used in the Randoms)? I ask this as I was going over my maps, and noticed that I had the same thing, and I sure as hell didn't do that intentionally, planet mod or not. >_>

 

Edit: Am I correct in assuming, that, bar icons, you have given me all the necessary files for your planets addon in the rars you uploaded? Just asking so that I don't accidentally delete an old planets file that's still needed.

Edited February 22, 2011 by Lavo

[NovaCameron]

Sure, keep it all the same.

[Lavo]

Also, please check my edit.