Religion

[DarthTofu]

Okay, I know what you're thinking- "He's trying to convert us! Somebody get this retard off the site!" No, actually, that isn't this is just a theory that I want to test to see how Science Fiction Fans are with religion. As you know, there is no reason that you have to reply to this or answer the pole, or confirm anything (I swear, I won't kill anyone... Especially since I don't know where you all live to kill you...) Anyway, what's everybody's religion? Personally I have no problem saying I'm an atheist.

[Trejiuvanat]

I'm missing the Force on that list.

 

I don't really believe in any religion(more like I dislike any church), and pretend to be an atheist or an agnostic is not really inspiring.

[Darth_Rob]

I am going through odd times now. I was brought up a practicing Christian, but am currently having a difficult time believing in a religion that makes no sense when science makes so much more sense. I suppose Im becoming more of a skeptic.

 

But I must say that I do believe in the moral teachings of Christianity, about being "nice", living a good life, blah blah blah. I personally have a good set of morals (in my opinion), and would like my future children to honor the same morals.

 

I must also say that I am totally against the church, of any religion. You do not have to sit in a great meeting place with a bunch of other people, repeating the same thing at the same time like a bunch of programmed robots, just to practice your faith. If you believe in a higher power, you do not need to go to a special place to be with Him/Her, they would be everywhere at all times. You could "pray" at home, work, on the street, during a bus ride, whenever. The church in unneccessary to any religion.

[Mad78]

I am Protestant but i ain't much of a religious guy.

[BadSamaritan]

My religion isn't up there, so I can't vote.

 

Pagan

[Jahled]

A rusty asteroid experiancing problems with it's existance is good enough for me to put on an alter and worship thoughtlessly, and define all my morality, etc...

[DarthTofu]

A rusty asteroid experiancing problems with it's existance is good enough for me to put on an alter and worship thoughtlessly, and define all my morality, etc...

 

So if electricity is derived from electrons, I guess this is proof that Morality is derived from morons... And I gotta agree with Rob about all his stuff there- I have no problem with any religious people (Other than KKK people), though I do kinda feel for 'em. After all, we atheists have more stuff than anyone else written fown about our belief- there are the blank pages at the end of the bible, the blank pages at the end of textbooks, the staticy part when a movie ends...

[Paul]

Well I am Catholic, at least that is how my Grandparents raised me, but currently don't practice it. At this point I believe in God but adhere to similiar ideas as Rob.- Grand Moff Conway

[Grand_Admiral_Thrawn]

Well, I guess Athiest best describes me, but I'm willing to accept the possibility of a "higher power" so long as it can be proven... I guess that sort of defeats the purpose of "faith" doesn't it?

[DarthTofu]

I guess so... I just wonder why we would have been made in teh first place. I mean, picture this, you have all power and are alone in the Universe. YOu can create a son of your own if you want to keep you company, but instead you descide to make a race of people below you. Why?

[Grand_Admiral_Thrawn]

Well, I don't want to start a debate here, but subjects like Philosophy and Theology are studied for one reason: man simply cannon accept the possibility that an occurace has no reason. No matter what it is, man will work feverishly to find out why some thing is, or has happened, and we think that there is an answer to everything. The simple fact is, some things just happen. There is no why, maybe not even a how, it simply is...

[Stellar_Magic]

What was it Nitche sp? said... "Fellow Creators the Creator seeks, not mindless masses..."

 

My personal belief is as follows, God creates a universe based on natural laws designed for the propogation and development of advanced intelligent beings capable of thinking for themselves. God delivers prophets and messengers to guide the races to moral thought and once there removes himself and allows them to develop on their own.

[AdmiralToguroAni]

I'm agnostic for one major reason--I can neither prove or disprove the existance of God. Either way at the beginning of time, we run into this:

 

Atoms were there, always were there, and always will be there under the law of conservation of matter. After the big bang, they formed everything.

 

God was there, always was there, and always will be there under religious doctrine. He formed everything.

 

At its base, we really don't have proof of our origin, so it could be either. Admittedly I tend to waver toward atheism, but until I have proof God doesn't exist, I cant for certain say he doesnt. I can however, say that in all likelihood he does not exist and live life like he doesn't, but I cannot really rule it out until more evidence is presented.

[Trejiuvanat]

Nietzsche...

 

Yours is a rather scientific view on the matter, I'm not really sure we can even take the advanced intelligent beings term to describe outrselves.

 

Well, I guess Athiest best describes me, but I'm willing to accept the possibility of a "higher power" so long as it can be proven... I guess that sort of defeats the purpose of "faith" doesn't it?

 

I'm standing close to your position, and atheism isn't the best description for it. Faith is an interesting concept, because it can be apart from religion, or rather be the cause behind religion at all.

[kaja]

Well, I'm a catholic, and I believe in the Holy Trinity.

 

I Don't believe in the "Theory" of Evolution. I Didn't come from Pond slime, Or Moneys for that matter......

 

As for the "Big Bang"... If it did happen, what started it? What was there before it? Nothing? It can't be nothing because there isn't anything to start it.

 

People that try to "Prove" that there is no God, are stupid. They spend most of their life trying to prove that there isn't something that they don't believe in.

 

I guess so... I just wonder why we would have been made in teh first place. I mean, picture this, you have all power and are alone in the Universe. YOu can create a son of your own if you want to keep you company, but instead you descide to make a race of people below you. Why?

 

Who knows God's intentions? Now I'm not all that sure Why he created us. And I probably will never know, atleast not until I die and Hopefully Eventually end up in Heaven.

 

If you have any Questions, please feel free to ask me.

Keep in mind this is just my opinion, and faith.

[Defender_16]

When i was in elementary and even highschool I tened to lean more toward atheism and then later into agnostic-ism (sp?).

 

But when I was in College I started to swing back to the more religious side of the spectrum. Not Christianity specifically but a general belief in God. I would still say I'm partially agnostic though because all of that schooling and information about the Universe I went out of my way to learn just doesn't go away.

 

I've been sitting at a crossroads for the past few years. Wanting to believe in God but still loving the sciences I depend upon so much.

[Grand_Admiral_Thrawn]

As for the "Big Bang"... If it did happen, what started it? What was there before it? Nothing? It can't be nothing because there isn't anything to start it.

 

Well, to start there was simply all of the matter and energy in the universe compounded into a single mass. At this time two forces were exerting influence over this mass, gravity and another, currently unnamed force, which rather than pulling the mass together would strive to push it apart. Now, usually these forces were in balance, keeping the mass whole. However, at some point the unnamed force, let us call it anti-gravity, exerted more power over the mass than gravity. Now, on a scale as large as we're talking here, even a slight increase in one force over the other would have massive results. So, anti-gravity's gaining the "upper hand", as it were, caused all of the energy and matter, basically plasma, to be exploded outwards: hence, Big "Bang". This all happens over billions of years, of course, eventually forming the universe as we know it today. Evidence of this can still be seen. The movement of galaxies away from other galaxies has been recorded, lending credence to the Bing Bang Theory.

 

People that try to "Prove" that there is no God, are stupid. They spend most of their life trying to prove that there isn't something that they don't believe in.

 

Yes, people trying to prove that God, or evolution to be fair, are stupid. But then, not many people try to do that. Theologists, the good ones anyhow, do not try to disprove evolution or science, but try to support the existence of a higher power. If a theologan comes up to me ans says"Evolution is bollocks, here's why, and that's why God is better" I have a low opinion. However, if a theologan, such as my friend's father, comes up to me and begins to explain his beliefs, supporting them in a reasonable manner, I respect him eminently. I've had this happen, and that is why I'm open to the possibility of a higher power. At the moment, however, the empirical evidence seems to support science.

 

It's good that you have strong beliefs Kaja, not many of today's youths can say that, but try and avoid saying people are stupid, idiots, or basically slamming anyone who doesn't agree with you, or even if they try to disprove your beliefs in a similarly inappropriate way. Look at everything in an as unemotional way as you can. Odd how reasoning is so very like the Force...

[DarthTofu]

lol. To quote Ghandi "We have a duty as man to study all religion without contempt or prejudice, taking from it that which will make us a better person to our fellow man"... Or something along those lines. That much said, no one is trying to convert anyone here, and arguments are not meant to arise from this as to whether or not there is a god or other higher force. Just wondering, who was the Buddhist? Rock on, man!

[PsychoInfiltrator]

I am a Christian. And if you want to use those odd and unnecessary weird terms-I am a practicing Christian, a Protestant, and an evangelical.

 

Well, I don't want to start a debate here, but subjects like Philosophy and Theology are studied for one reason: man simply cannon accept the possibility that an occurace has no reason. No matter what it is, man will work feverishly to find out why some thing is, or has happened, and we think that there is an answer to everything. The simple fact is, some things just happen. There is no why, maybe not even a how, it simply is...

 

DarthTofu

 

Man can accept the possiblity, yes, but many choose not to-like me.

I guess so... I just wonder why we would have been made in teh first place. I mean, picture this, you have all power and are alone in the Universe. YOu can create a son of your own if you want to keep you company, but instead you descide to make a race of people below you. Why?

 

God's ways are not our ways, and His wisdom is not worldly. If this makes no sense and looks like a dodge, replace God and His with women's and their as well as worldly with ours and you might understand that that statement can be, and I believe is, true.

 

 

My personal belief is as follows, God creates a universe based on natural laws designed for the propogation and development of advanced intelligent beings capable of thinking for themselves. God delivers prophets and messengers to guide the races to moral thought and once there removes himself and allows them to develop on their own.

 

An interesting theory, to be sure. But why create something merely to abandon it, unaided. It is proven that through essentially inertia, all things break down. If He has gone to the trouble of sending messengers and prophets, why stop? Or, better yet, devise and implement a method to keep His created people 'safe,' should they so choose?

 

I'm standing close to your position, and atheism isn't the best description for it. Faith is an interesting concept, because it can be apart from religion, or rather be the cause behind religion at all.

 

An interesting concept. Faith is the core of Christianity, not mindless tasks and pitiful customs-that came when people made Christianity into a religion, instead of leaving it as it was-a Faith.

 

Well, I'm a catholic, and I believe in the Holy Trinity.

 

I Don't believe in the "Theory" of Evolution. I Didn't come from Pond slime, Or Moneys for that matter......

 

As for the "Big Bang"... If it did happen, what started it? What was there before it? Nothing? It can't be nothing because there isn't anything to start it.

 

Good points, all.

 

People that try to "Prove" that there is no God, are stupid. They spend most of their life trying to prove that there isn't something that they don't believe in.

 

Never ridicule people you disagree with. In fact, never ridicule anybody-good life lesson.

When i was in elementary and even highschool I tened to lean more toward atheism and then later into agnostic-ism (sp?).

 

But when I was in College I started to swing back to the more religious side of the spectrum. Not Christianity specifically but a general belief in God. I would still say I'm partially agnostic though because all of that schooling and information about the Universe I went out of my way to learn just doesn't go away.

 

I've been sitting at a crossroads for the past few years. Wanting to believe in God but still loving the sciences I depend upon so much

 

Want to have a chat? It would be beneficial for both of us.

 

Theologists, the good ones anyhow, do not try to disprove evolution or science, but try to support the existence of a higher power.

 

That's your opinion, not a fact-please don't present it that way. Thanks.

[Trejiuvanat]

An interesting concept. Faith is the core of Christianity, not mindless tasks and pitiful customs-that came when people made Christianity into a religion, instead of leaving it as it was-a Faith.

 

As for the rites and ceremonies, for a person that is spiriturally linked to the ceremonies there can be no greater sense of communion than reviving myth through a rite. For a believer to (drink wine at church|fast during Ramadan|sit and medidate under a tree) can be a very interior spiritual moment that is strongly felt. For someone outside it might seem a weird thing, I for one cannot understand how people are closer to God by sititng once per week listening to an old man's lecture of what moral is, just as I cannot comprehend why fast all day and eat all night will bring you closer to God. But as an outsider I am only an observer and cannot feel whatever connection there is.

 

Faith is not only at the core of Christianity, but to religion in general, or philosophy for all (would-be) Atheists. Faith is the autonomous reflex to believe that there is a greater purpose behind everything we do, did or will do, it is a common thing in all people. A god may as well be the result of humans shoving that belief to another entity that should be responsible for what happens.

 

Faith is the result of the uncertainty of the future, if we knew exactly what would happen, as if it was an unerratical precise fact, there would be no need for hope. Faith is an attempt to assure ourselves that of all possible outcomes, that one we wish is the true one. Thus doubt -a very human thing- may lie behind the working of faith, as antidote to it.

 

Faith can be a dangerous thing as well, as it must be balanced, not give in to a blind faith, but not be faithless. Shrugs. Faith is a very personal thing, as it is linked closely to every individual belief. Our lack (or not) thereof has us here tonight arguing about the existence of a greater power, that is doubt speaking for us. Science and Religion are expected not to walk hand in hand, one represents doubt that forces mankind to seek new knowledge, the other represents faith, that actions have a purpose no matter how hidden it is and that they will be revealed when it is necessary. Still I refuse to accept that both aspects cannot be united, I cannot dismiss the technical knowledge and science, I do admit that my current shape is the result of evolution. Spiritually I cannot dismiss the necessity of a greater power, I could claim that I have created a divinity in my image's likeness and attribute my faith to it. In the end though, I am left with the same questions there always are.

 

I wonder what God believes in...

 

God moves the player,

the player moves the pawn,

which god behind God starts the plot,

of time and dust,

of agonies and dreams.

 

(A crappy translation of J.L. Borges's poem: Chess).

[Jahled]

Speaking of religion....SATANISTS! This weekend is your last chance

to concieve if you want He Who Walks Backwards' child born on 6/6/6. Any later and to be out then he'd be premature and perhaps a bit weedy. Go go Beelzebaby action!!

 

[Mad78]

Speaking of religion....SATANISTS! This weekend is your last chance

to concieve if you want He Who Walks Backwards' child born on 6/6/6. Any later and to be out then he'd be premature and perhaps a bit weedy. Go go Beelzebaby action!!

 

J you have the trick to pick out these little details. Even though i don't know if we have any satanists on the site... Do we?

[AdmiralToguroAni]

I can see this turning into a debate rather than a statement of people's religion, or lack thereof. If we want to have at it, we should make a new forum. The purpose of this one is to help DarthTofu with his theory.

Unless Tofu already has the data he needs, and in that case carry on and I'll jump in when the waters are hot enough

[Jahled]

Speaking of religion....SATANISTS! This weekend is your last chance

to concieve if you want He Who Walks Backwards' child born on 6/6/6. Any later and to be out then he'd be premature and perhaps a bit weedy. Go go Beelzebaby action!!

 

J you have the trick to pick out these little details. Even though i don't know if we have any satanists on the site... Do we?

 

Simple mathematics my dear boy!

[DarthTofu]

I can see this turning into a debate rather than a statement of people's religion, or lack thereof. If we want to have at it, we should make a new forum. The purpose of this one is to help DarthTofu with his theory.

Unless Tofu already has the data he needs, and in that case carry on and I'll jump in when the waters are hot enough

 

This was just a random survey that I wanted to check curiosity with. I was wondering if sci-fi fans were more analitical from seeing how science can be, to quote Arthur C. Clark, indistinguishable from magic. Another thread is free to be started, or this one can continue for a debate. As a good debate starter, I'll state one main reason for atheism: Religion has always been about what we don't understand.

 

Supporting facts that someone will eventually pick apart in some way shape or form: 1: The Greeks, Romans, ect. developed early polytheism. Why? Because they didn't know why it rained sometimes but not other times, or why some wives bore no children, or volcanoes erupted. Thus they invented gods to have done each thing. God was developed as an ideology to explain what we don't understand: Life, the Universe, and everything. Oh, wait, that was Deep Thought...

 

2: How do we know that god might have been responsible for all in the bible? In the bible it states that it rained for foutry days and fourty nights with Noah's arc, and that a rainbow appeared to symbolise that God would never again flood the earth. What if these people merely experianced monsoons, or a hurricane, which lasted a shorter amount of time and were eventually changed to a longer period of time? After such a storm, a rainbow is only logical, and an arc with a few people and animals could easily have floated to an uneffected land mass.

 

I'll have more reasons to back myself up as these are picked apart by the Christians, Catholics, Jews, and other religious folks (I just forgot what religions were mentioned- if I skipped yours, it isn't a sign that I think your religion is lowlier.)