Jahled Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Ok, the Chinese have launched a man into space, and the monopoly on space travel by the US/Russia has been broken! I'm happy for the Chinese and their achievement, but am curious; the entire operation was controlled by the Chinese military. Will this lead to competition or coroperation in the space program? And call me an unrealistic hippy, but i'm just thinking how much could be achieved if the world's space agencies pooled their resources and did their stuff for humanity; you can't see any borders from orbit! (Jahled types listening to imagine...) Seriously guys, the BBC news tonight said it's likely to be India or Japan who can achieve next what the Chinese have just accomplished; just imagine the progress if the world got together with it's collective resources to 'do stuff' in the cosmos! http://www.jahled.co.uk/smallmonkeywars.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_La_forge Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 I don't think that India could launch a space project. Altrough it would be great! That event just tells us how powerful Chinese empire growed in the past 50 years. An economical giant, who supports the whole World with his products. So it has some kind of monopolium too. Now they are able to launch a spaceship too. Of course, it's a glorius moment. But I'm really curious about the future... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWR Staff - Executive Evaders99 Posted October 15, 2003 SWR Staff - Executive Share Posted October 15, 2003 Of course, that's what the International Space Station was supposed to be.. but mainly its been the US taking over for the debt of Russia. And now that the US shuttles have been grounded, it seems we're in a bit of a bind. There will be no reason for the governments to work together unless there is a threat to world... stay an asteroid headed towards Earth? Evaders99http://swrebellion.com/images/banners/rebellionbanner02or6.gif Webmasterhttp://swrebellion.com/images/banners/swcicuserbar.png Administrator Fighting is terrible, but not as terrible as losing the will to fight.- SW:Rebellion Network - Evaders Squadron Coding -The cake is a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahled Posted October 15, 2003 Author Share Posted October 15, 2003 At humanity's presant course it seems an asteroid is the last thing that should trouble us! Together, communist or capitalist, we've managed to over fish our oceans to deserts, alter our planet's climate to levels that quite frankly can't be ignored, and are risking, it seems, all 'stabilizing' regions of the world where there is a lot of oil! This year was the first time I got sun-burned in here in the UK just from being out and about on my bike! The climate is changing, and it's extremely serious! Above us, and what lies beyond, is perhaps hope, because down here it seems, we're not prepared to share the bread. The only time I get the impression of genuine coperation between scientists/interlectuals is when watching programs or reading stuff about astronomy and the mind warping stuff these guys are getting together concerning theories of existance and other mind-boggling stuff! Think images of galaxies...from two billion years ago....political alignments pale into insignificance; and how could they have any meaning from a region where the very edge of comprehension has been reached, if not tickled, and in some respects passed.... Some of this stuff is simply daunting, even on basic levels of opening a newspaper and looking at an image from the US Hubble telescope that is millions if not billions of years old, and as such; far away. I guess what I was trying to get at in my original post, was how much further we could; as a collective entity (get it!) progress in our understanding of science and the benefits it brings to us all, if the bugits put aside by the respective space-faring nations worked together. At this very moment in time there's a very brave Chinese dude doing earth in orbit looking down at the most beautiful planet in our solar system. He's probably exclaiming the Mandarin equivelant of 'Rah,' or 'Woo!' And thinking of his kids and wife. How much more could be achieved if say there had been some American, a French dude, an Arab, some Russian, say a Brazilian, and some dude/dudette from Pakistan, looking out from that same rocket..at the same time! It would at least perhaps give some food for thought to the tarnished souls who take their religious beliefs a tab to seriously and believe the supreme being/way is somehow Christian, Muslim, or whatever label language can label what is completely infinite of said understanding. Ok, said my piece, I think I said what I wanted to say. http://www.jahled.co.uk/smallmonkeywars.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWR Staff - Executive Evaders99 Posted October 15, 2003 SWR Staff - Executive Share Posted October 15, 2003 Jahled, in a perfect world... yes it would be good for us to band our resources together. Unfortunately, we're only human. What is someone's truth can be another person's bane. I'm not saying that humans can't cooperate, but realistically, we're competitive animals. I don't believe you can get that many people together without a substantial threat to the survival of humanity. Evaders99http://swrebellion.com/images/banners/rebellionbanner02or6.gif Webmasterhttp://swrebellion.com/images/banners/swcicuserbar.png Administrator Fighting is terrible, but not as terrible as losing the will to fight.- SW:Rebellion Network - Evaders Squadron Coding -The cake is a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisMiggell Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 The only time I get the impression of genuine coperation between scientists/interlectuals is when watching programs or reading stuff about astronomy and the mind warping stuff these guys are getting together concerning theories of existance and other mind-boggling stuff! Think images of galaxies...from two billion years ago....political alignments pale into insignificance; and how could they have any meaning from a region where the very edge of comprehension has been reached, if not tickled, and in some respects passed.... Some of this stuff is simply daunting, even on basic levels of opening a newspaper and looking at an image from the US Hubble telescope that is millions if not billions of years old, and as such; far away. Actually the oldest images we're currently getting are approximately 13 billion years old. This is light coming to us from stars that are 13 billion light years away. we know that there are stars beyond them, and fully expect to eventually be able to see stars that are as much as 15 billion lightyears distant, and thus see 15 billion years back into history, which is commonly believed to be the age of the universe. at the moment we'll have to wait another 2 billion years to see them though, but tech is getting better, so i't more likely to be more like 2 to 20 years uuntil we start seeing light that is as old as the universe itself! Elvismiggell. Strike me down and i will become more powerful than you can ever imagine... Nu kyr'adyc, shi taab'echaaj'la Not gone, merely marching far away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scathane Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 Jahled, in a perfect world... yes it would be good for us to band our resources together. Unfortunately, we're only human. What is someone's truth can be another person's bane. I'm not saying that humans can't cooperate, but realistically, we're competitive animals. I don't believe you can get that many people together without a substantial threat to the survival of humanity. Or, as Calvin from Calvin and Hobbes put it in one of his comic strips: "I was reading about how countless species are being pushed toward extinction by man's destruction of forests... Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahled Posted October 20, 2003 Author Share Posted October 20, 2003 ....Jahled bows in Elizebethian dramatic Shakespier sort of way...whilst wiping Fosters from his monitor... Another thing from Calvin & Hobbes I am reminded off every morning when I 'find myself awake,' is the dream he had where he desided to count all the stones and pebbles he could find... and bores himself awake... REALITY! http://www.jahled.co.uk/smallmonkeywars.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisMiggell Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Never heard of these things, what are they? Elvismiggell. Strike me down and i will become more powerful than you can ever imagine... Nu kyr'adyc, shi taab'echaaj'la Not gone, merely marching far away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahled Posted October 21, 2003 Author Share Posted October 21, 2003 Calvin and Hobbes is a 'kid's' comic book, go to your nearest bookshop and flick through one, they are the funniest stuff around! Anyway, Calvin is one of my role models. I aspire to be like him everyday. http://www.jahled.co.uk/smallmonkeywars.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scathane Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Anyway, Calvin is one of my role models. I aspire to be like him everyday. You are like him, Jahled! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_mask Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Elvis, have you never seen these two ? The little guy and the tiger ? http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/5183/animated9pn.gifhttp://img146.imageshack.us/img146/1778/reloadedbannerdu8.gifhttp://www.swrebellion.com/images/banners/rebellionbanner02or6.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2-Opus2 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I think that until the private sector, including those in the private sector of other competing nations, can find commercial aspects to space, the average Joe Citizen isn't going to care about space or its potential. Costs are ever more prohibitive. So until private companies can lend a competitive edge to foster futher interest in space, we're left with the resources of the richest contributing nations' and their government programs...and the complexities that brings in working internationally. i.e. I heard a recent radio news broadcast of the case of the Russians looking for some type of reimbursement for taking up the slack of the US shuttles, still out of the picture, because they're using their modules to move crew back and forth now until that's resolved. I think they are right to ask for payments, and this only further illustrates the need to work internationally. Now imagine what the future would look like with additional private enterprises taking advantage of space. Note how crippling the economy suffered for the month or so that airlines lost business in the wake of 9/11, now transfer that to a future where we've incorporated a great deal of space activity into our economies. An accident, no matter how large or small could concievably cripple most of Earth's entire space-based economic systems, even if the downtime seemed insignificant (i.e. see the one month or so example of our airlines). Which also comes back to a fluid international partnership in dealing with space issues, both governmentally and commercially. Another example of something that's really got me nervous about our futures in space...The thing that scares me the most, as more and more countries take advantage of space and what it can offer...is all the circling pile of space debris from so many craft with expendable components (i.e see rockets and such that require many "stages" to get into orbit, now multiply by the 40+ years or so we've been sending crap into orbit...how do we begin to clean that up?). Sure, the best thing we can offer is data on all the known tragectories most of this junk travels in and share that knowledge, but the people doing that must also account for anything new any other entity puts into space. Anyway, my fear is if governments don't have any plans to deal with it, that burden will fall to the private sector. The more we send stuff up, the more important these issues become the longer they are not dealt with...hindering futher efforts as we slowly cut ourselves off from accessing space entirely. My hope is that soon we'll have a commercial remedy for our "heavy lifting" fleet of government shuttles. No other country yet has a craft capable of hauling to and from space, vast amounts of cargo. Not only will the shuttle program most likely have to contract out for their new line of shuttles, but that'll need some supplementation for downtimes such as this one. And one of the only ways other than research to warrant many more is to come up with some commercial applications. My only other hope, this one regarding the Mars hype is...I'd much rather see the world develop its "backyard" a little first, before dedicating a manned landing mission to Mars. To create some stepping stones as it were, to get there. I've always been a proponent that we should try to develop the moon somewhat before continuing elsewhere. There's still much more we can learn about that that might even help us for that eventual Mars expedition. Granted, I'd be ok with manned "flybys" of Mars, akin to what we did as the precursors for landing men on the moon...It only makes sense in regards to finding adequate landing/colony sites. But I feel a manned landing mission asap would be a terrible misstep. I am more in favor of, after setting up a fledgling colony on the moon, to begin establishing some rudimentary space infastructure. For example, setting up an orbital platform of some type as a transfer site not just around the moon, but one around Mars too. The first people that go there will need adequate safeguards to get back should something go wrong. No doubt though with the moon as one of the exceptions, an orbital platform might not be terribly important to have given its low gravity (i.e. a shuttle could probably take off from the surface like an aircraft does here on Earth, only it could keep going with its available thrust if fully fueled to make orbit). Anyway, there's a bunch of stuff in my mind that could/should be done first before the major push to a colonization effort on Mars. The major ones for me is dealing with the space junk and developing further commercial enterprises for space. I think that some of these efforts ought to move concurrently with one another if not one at a time. One of the days I hope I'm around for research-wise, is the day they can put an observational "Hubble"-type telescope (ground based or orbital) on the dark side of the moon, which would supposedly have one of the best views of the night sky, better even than Earth orbit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2-Opus2 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I heard some more space station talk today. Apparently they want the crew they just sent up to come back. They say the equipment used to monitor life support systems like air and water may be on the blink, and NASA officials want to wait until their shuttle system is up and running before resuming operations since those vehicles are the main means of resupply (meaning if something is broke or going to break soon, they'd rather wait til they can ferry the parts up). I don't know that they've decided anything final on the subject, but I know they've been talking about it since before this latest crew rotation. I think they ought to wait and be sure the station is in a stable orbit before they do anything drastic, like leaving the thing unmanned heh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2-Opus2 Posted October 26, 2003 Share Posted October 26, 2003 I found myself back at the space.com site, interesting articles there. Right now I've been parusing over highlights from the Columbia Accident Investigation Board's final report http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/caib_details_030826.html Not a bad substitute site to visit when TFN or starwars.com has crap or sparingly few updates, plus, it's reality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scathane Posted October 27, 2003 Share Posted October 27, 2003 Wow, that's a really great site! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2-Opus2 Posted October 27, 2003 Share Posted October 27, 2003 Yep, I visit it once in a blue moon, but each time I do I'm not disappointed, great stuff there. I thought that report incidentally was spot on about NASA, it touched on many of my concerns about the future of manned space missions. They need to worry about the lives in their control out there, not some bottom line on a budget or pressure from politicians. I especially found that bit about congressional earmarks – congressional additions to the NASA budget request that reflect targeted members’ interests. Disturbing stuff, but I wouldn't put it past some thieving politicians. Still, it makes you angrier to realize they're taking these earmarks out of their total budget. I'd be less angry if they had added more to their budget rather than gouging from it for their own special interests which had nothing mind you, to do with NASA operations in general. Makes me kind of wonder where experts like this were when they investigated the JFK assasination heh, they did a pretty good job on NASA and I especially love how they slammed Congress (gently though it seemed). No one single entity was at fault for any failures, but a bunch of groups factored in. I also thought it a shame that the shuttle program was competing directly with the station's...that's a huge conflict of interest considering the station wouldn't exist without the shuttle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahled Posted October 27, 2003 Author Share Posted October 27, 2003 Woo! I haven't been to that site for ages R2! I forgot how awesome the site is. Thankiness for the reminder. I used to spend hours and hours and hours looking and the image banks of the universe. Stuff like this is what makes the internet golden. http://www.jahled.co.uk/smallmonkeywars.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2-Opus2 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Yea they had some funky little web games there too (probably still do, I didn't look this time). If you can remember that quiz type game with Robert Picardo in it from way back, that's about the time I first started going there. They must change stuff up fairly frequently with their games so I'd look into those too. One game they always tend to have, which I never really get sick of really, is a variation or other on that classic Lunar Landing game (last time I looked, I think they changed it from the moon to Mars or something), its a good time waster hehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElvisMiggell Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 Granted, I'd be ok with manned "flybys" of Mars, akin to what we did as the precursors for landing men on the moon...It only makes sense in regards to finding adequate landing/colony sites. But I feel a manned landing mission asap would be a terrible misstep. I am more in favor of, after setting up a fledgling colony on the moon, to begin establishing some rudimentary space infastructure. For example, setting up an orbital platform of some type as a transfer site not just around the moon, but one around Mars too. The first people that go there will need adequate safeguards to get back should something go wrong. No doubt though with the moon as one of the exceptions, an orbital platform might not be terribly important to have given its low gravity (i.e. a shuttle could probably take off from the surface like an aircraft does here on Earth, only it could keep going with its available thrust if fully fueled to make orbit). Two main problems. The only material that adequately protects from solar radiation in space is, lead. Rather heavy to get into space! Until we find a better way to protect against solar radiation there will be no mars mission, a manned one that is. The other problem is people really aren't keen on nuclear power in space, with is the only really viable fuel source at present. Elvismiggell. Strike me down and i will become more powerful than you can ever imagine... Nu kyr'adyc, shi taab'echaaj'la Not gone, merely marching far away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scathane Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 Elvis is right. If I'm not mistaken, there's even an international treaty against using nuclear power or dumping nuclear waste in space... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2-Opus2 Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 Agreed on the nuclear waste thing. Still there are promising alternatives. I saw recently on one of those science channels about a satellite mission to visit an asteroid (the craft name eludes me atm), and the craft was the first to use this Ion drive technology. While that may solve the propulsion issue with regards to contaminating space with our waste, there's still the matter of protecting crew for a manned space flight. The problem with that propulsion tech though, is it takes a long time to get up to speed, but once it does, its goin pretty good. Another problem that came up with that engine in that show I saw, was they had a very small foreign object that interfered and they were afraid they wouldn't get the engine started. Anyway, watching this made me realize that, while we're making strides in some areas, others are still lacking big time. Still, in the end, I think from a general sense, we're living in exciting times. We're witnessing the dawn of some impressive technology in respect to manned space flight, and even unmanned space flight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trejiuvanat Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 India and Japan certainly are the candidates to go to space. Brazil's space plan had an accident about two months ago, when the rocket they were building was destroyed. I can't remember the details, but it was a severe setback. Last I knew the NASA was working on a new Plasma engine for their first mission to mars, somewhere in the next five years. http://www.swrebellion.com/~jahled/Trej/banner.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOCL Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I find it interesting that no one mentioned the idea of "space colonies". Yeah, go ahead, laugh all you want, but the idea has been around for as long as man has looked at the stars and said, "Ooo, pretty; I wish I could go up there." I mean, space colonies could be set up on the Moon, but then you can make "free-floating" ones to be in the LaGrange points around the Earth (there exist a total of 5 LaGrange points). Here's a good site about it all of the space colony (don't laugh, I know it is related to an anime series or two, but it has A LOT of fact about space colonies in it). But as mentioned before, as much as I would love to see us going into space more and more, I can't honestly see it happening. Humans are greedy and without a reason that invloves gain, why would we? I mean, what politician is going to say: "Alright, you can have 5 billion more to go into space"? None, sadly. The only reason NASA exists here in the U.S. is probably because of image. I'm sure that if it wasn't because the American public would get angry at not having men in space, the U.S. government would take away the space program and use the money for other matters, and probably allow it to fall into the hands of politically active private corporations. It wouldn't be the first time it's happened (not specifically with the space program). One way or another, it will happen. Mankind will stop wanting to be contained on Earth and will break free more and more until finally...well...we'll see. Well, if any of you are interested in owning land in space, I once found a website where they said they were legally (through the UN) selling land on the Moon, Mars, the moons of Mars, and one of the moons of Jupiter. SOCL: Putting the BE in BEAK.Read the Forum Rules - Welcome the New Members - Rebellion Reloaded - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scathane Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 I don't think the idea of space colonies is preposterous at all. In fact, I think only time stands in the way of their reality... I'm not sure whether there's any company on earth that can legally sell space bodies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now