Is Palpatine Anakin's father?

[Bill]

Is Palpatine Anakin's father?

[Eko]

If you think really convulutedly then it [the prophecy] could have feasably been a Sith idea all along:

 

1) A Sith Lord (Palpatine? or possibly his master) creates the prophecy

 

2) The fufilment of this prophecy would be Anakin.

 

3) Using the 'Dark Lore of the Sith' mention in EIII, midichlorians are manipulated to create Anakin, the fufilment of the prophecy.

 

4) Palpatine becomes Naboo senator to watch over Anakin.

 

5) The Jedi are attracted to the plaent by the trade fleet in order to notice Anakin.

 

6) The Jedi train him whilst Palpatine manouvers behind the scenes.

 

7) The Sith trap is sprung, the Jedi are brought down from the inside by the Sith created prodigy.

 

8 ) The unforeseen part, Anakin throughs Palpy down the shaft after retaining a tiny spark of good.

 

Thats the outline of what i've been thinking on anyway, I could write it in more detail later if thats a bit brief.

 

Hows that for a hypothesis?

[DarthTofu]

Far better than mine.

[AdmiralToguroAni]

I dont know if 60 or so years (or even 100) is enough to make a prophesy believable by people as smart (?) as Yoda, Windu, and the mysterious Yaddle (who never appears after episode 1). It may be something thats really, really old. Like slightly post KOTOR old. I'm also convinced that while Dooku was a pawn, Maul wasn't. I believe that if Palpy or his master really wanted to raise the Chosen one, he would have done so in a more controlled environment. Being a senator from Naboo who stays on Coruscant all the time is too far away to maintain control over Anakin. Rather, I think Sidious/Palpy was prepared to start the Clone Wars with Maul. Maul was a weakling and would NEVER get strong enough to become at threat to Sidious, so Sid could use Maul for Jedi assassinations during the Clone Wars. Dooku, by this time, had already gone to the Dark Side and, though he wouldnt be a Sith Lord, was still convinced that the Republic needed to be cleansed and so went along with it. To that end, the Clone Wars and Palpy's rise to power could have been done WITHOUT Anakin. Think about it--we all know Palpy could have owned Windu any time he wanted. Maul could take out those younglings, and he'd still Order 66 the remaining Jedi. Lets also not forget that without trying to replace Anakin, he'd still keep Dooku around, and Dooku would have been able to kill Obi-wan in a straight fight (as we saw in Ep. 3). Given that, even Grievous would still be alive. It seems that if Qui-Gon's ship hadn't been busted up and had to dock at Tat, Palpy couldnt have found Anakin, and so he would have won the war as Sidious, and not Palpy.

 

Now consider this:

 

Grievous is nearly immortal now, thanks to his droid body. Maul is fairly young, and Dooku, though old, was persuasive enough to probably turn those Younglings once Sidious wins. It seems to me that Palpy sacrificed three good underlings for one slightly better one, and because of his short-sightedness.....he got the shaft.

[Eko]

Damn, in a rush to prove this new idea of mine I made a fundamental and quite basic error, I presumed for some reason best known to the part of my brain responsible for all my careless mistake, that Anakin was born on Naboo! My hypothesis needs more work. I shall redo it tommorow.

[DarthTex]

AdmiralToguroAni wrote:

 

Dooku, by this time, had already gone to the Dark Side and, though he wouldnt be a Sith Lord

 

Wasn't Dooku a Sith Lord? Then who was Darth Tyrannus?

 

Darth Maul got sloppy and over confident with Obi-wan and paid the ultimate price. I haven't read/seen how Dooku was recruited by Sidious, but he filled the apprentice vacancy (although it already appeared to me, he would not keep the position long enough to eventually "replace" Sidious. He was too old). When Anakin came along, Sidious was thinking ahead, way ahead, to get this new recruit.

 

If you have read the NJO series, Zenoma Sekot believed the Jedi were wrong about the Force, there is no Dark Side or Light Side; there is only the Force. It just depended on how others perceived your use of the Force, that made the distinction between good and bad.

 

The Jedi were complacent from years without a "conflict" (the Sith? prior to the rule of two). They couldn't find Palpy in front of their noses. They couldn't tell the Senate was going rotten and that the Jedi order would fall. You could say there was "too much" of the Light Side of the Force out in the galaxy. Anakin (Darth Vader) brought balance by decreasing the Jedi numbers to be more in line with the number of Sith (not 1000's vs 2, but maybe a handful vs 2).

[Evaders99]

Tyranus was Dooku - I think maybe he is saying that Dooku would never be the Sith Master, because Sidious would always have a new apprentice

[Skynxnex]

Actually Lucas in one interview after Ep3 came out, said that the mention of Plagueis served two roles. One, it was to make the audience decide on their own if Plagueis was some kind of super Sith Lord more powerful than Palpatine who had possibly created Anakin. Two, it was maybe a story Palpatine said about himself, and that he was in fact Plagueis.

 

My take on it is that Plagueis is in fact Palpatine's master and that Plagueis must have had this knowledge of using the midichlorians to create life and didnt tell Palpatine about it. As a result, when Palpatine decided to become the master he killed his teacher and more than likely when going over his teacher's notes and so on discovered that his master had in fact found a way to achieve immortality. Palpatine himself said to Anakin after Mace got thrown out the window that 'to cheat death only one has attained that power but if we work together..' so in other words, he more or less confirms that Plagueis was in fact his master.

[DarthTofu]

According to the book ( I didn't want to wait for the movie) Plagueis was originally Qui Gon's master who turned to the dark side and ordered the clones so that the repulblic had to use them to stop the seperatists. Palpy stole his plans.

[DarthTex]

DarthTofu wrote:

 

According to the book ( I didn't want to wait for the movie) Plagueis was originally Qui Gon's master who turned to the dark side and ordered the clones so that the repulblic had to use them to stop the seperatists. Palpy stole his plans.

 

Well, that adds another story conflict. If Plagueis was the Sith Master, and Palpatine/Sidious the apprentice, then was Darth Maul an apprentice to an apprentice? The clone troopers were originally ordered at the time of TPM, so Sidious/Maul were already paired as Master/apprentice. Was Sofedious (sp? Mentioned by the cloners as the "Jedi" who placed the original order) really Plagueis? My guess is that Sofedious (sp?) was an agent of Sidious, and was killed or disposed of after the order was placed to keep it secret.

 

Jango used the "cloner" dart to kill the assassin that was after Padme. Was that done "on purpose"? Otherwise, the Jedi wouldn't have found the clone army to use on Genosis, or for that matter the coming war. I guess that's why Sidious wanted to keep up the assassination attempts on Padme ("attempt" being the key word, not actually completing the assassination), so eventually the Jedi would find the clones.

[AdmiralToguroAni]

Are you sure you're not thinking of Tyranus instead of Plagueis? Dooku was Qui-gon's master, and ordered the clones posing as Sifo-Dyas

[DarthTex]

In ATOC Obi-wan mentioned that "Sifo-Dyas" disappeared 10 years prior. Did Sidious have "two" apprentices (Dooku/Tyranus and Maul)? Or was Dooku "recruited" shortly after Maul's death?

[DarthTofu]

Well, from what I know, Seifodious (However you spell it) was really Plaugeias. He, along with Dooku and nineteen other jedi formed the "Fallen twenty-one" who were Jedi who quit the order due to personal matters or fear of turning to the dark side, or something. Since they still knew the jedi powers, though, most of them did become sith lords and all, eventually being killed. This was spread out over a long perios of time with the fallen twenty-one, just FYI. Most of them were already killed before episode one, or were just good little hermits that Vader eventually slaughtered.

[DarthTex]

From a book I read (I don't remember which one, maybe the Thrawn Duology?), Yoda went to Dagobah because that's where he tracked down and fought a Dark Jedi (not Sith). The Dark Jedi was killed in "the tree" that Luke eventually visits. Anyway, that's where Yoda goes in exile because he uses the "Dark Side" residue in the tree as a "screen" to keep Vader and whoever from finding him.

[DarthTofu]

Thrawn trilogy amigo. But, yeah, I think that's where one of the fallen twenty-one went. And it's the cave, not the tree. I read it fairly recently and have a memory for random facts . i think the outbound flight project'll get into it some. Not sure when it's set for release, though.

[DarthTex]

Nope, wasn't the trilogy, pardner. The trilogy had the crazy clone Jedi J'Caboth (sp?) in it. I'm sure it was the duology. The duology dealt with the Thrawn impersonator (Flim? Flin?), Moff Disra and an ex-royal guard stormtrooper. Didn't they concot some scheme about leaking information that the Bothans helped the Empire wipe out the Caasimi (sp?)? People everywhere were trying to dig up the info. Booster Terrik took his SD to Obra-skai in the Imperial Remnant to get access to their library. Talon Karrde already had a slicer working in the Obra-skai library. Talon got the info from his former boss who was "retired and reborn(?)". The former boss was on the ship the Dark Jedi comandeered when Yoda was on his tail. That's basically what I remember.

[DarthTofu]

It was the Thrawn trilogy that it was mentioned in. positive. Leiah mentions something about a dark jedi who was tracked all the way to Deigobah and luke finally reveals that was where he was trained by Yoda. he eventually winds up going back to Degobah, hoping to find some form of a clue in Yoda's hut, but, having lived on Tatooine all of his life, he didn't realize that buildings would decompose in a swamplike environment. Still looking foor a clue, he goes into the cave, see's the thing about Mara on the sail barge stealing his light saber. Then he finds the transmiter that was primed and ready to use froma dark jedi's ship, which had potential to be something, but never became one. he takes it to lando and lando IDs it as a ship caller. I told you, i remember things. And besides, i never read the duology and I remember this from the trilogy, so it must be right! If this had a\n evilly superior smirk I would use it, btu ican't. j/k, but still, it was the trilogy. Positive.

[Paul]

Basically you are both correct. The facts were mentioned differently in both the Thrawn trilogy and the Thrawn duology. How you each stated the facts are correct as each book used the facts you mentioned. Both of your memoriesw are working fine - Grand Moff Conway

[DarthTofu]

Oh... dangit, I thought I was being superior... (Bangs head against bulkhead until it splits sending him out into hard vacume) *Ghasp!* Neep air! (Explodes due to lack of pressure... Not that I would have actually been able to talk in vacume, there being nothing for the sound waves to hit... Oh well

[DarthTex]

Paul wrote:

 

Basically you are both correct.

Both of your memories are working fine

 

Gracias Amigo! I didn't think I was getting that old yet (Is the mind the first or second thing to go? ). It has been quite awhile since I last read either series.

[Eko]

Hmm, i thought the hips went at some point...

[DarthTofu]

Dude, don't even joke about that sort of thing with me! I got teased so much when I broke my arm... Not where you would normally break our arm, either- I snapped it right up near my shoulder where, as orthopedic doctor put it "I've only seen old ladies snap this bone". That and their hips. Thse are the two most difficult bones to break in a human body... Have to have what they call a "shoulder imobilizer", translates into a whole crap load of velcro and and a sling for a combined period of nine weeks. It really sucks. yeah, so that was severely off topic I appoligise to those who are actually productive... All three of you out there!

[Eko]

Oh, sorry about that, hope I didn't offend you

 

And yeah, it is getting a bit off topic, hmm, maybe Palpatine had a hip replacement, there, that justifies that bit

[DarthTofu]

No need to appoligize, mate! I just enjoy bringing up the story- snapped it on a damned rail I was trying to grind off of. When fronsides turn into Royals, bad things happen... Okay, this is justified under the topic because aggressive skating has always been an ancient Jedi method of keeping in shape and becoming atuned with the force. just like DDR.

[Skynxnex]

According to the book ( I didn't want to wait for the movie) Plagueis was originally Qui Gon's master who turned to the dark side and ordered the clones so that the repulblic had to use them to stop the seperatists. Palpy stole his plans.

 

 

Um..what is the name of the book? Also, I have never ever heard of this before. I dont recall Lucas even saying this in an interview so I am highly skeptical.

 

As it stands to me, Plagueis is/was Palpatine's master who had mastered the midichlorians and then Palpatine killed him in his sleep. Palpatine later found out that his master had achieved this power and from then on kept trying to find it out for himself. Thats what I am thinking anyway.

[DarthTofu]

Okay, Plaugeis was Seiphodeas. See, Seiphodeas was one of the fallen twenty-one (As according to "Star Wars: Episode Three: Revenge of the Sith). Seifodeas ordered the clone army in the first place and implanted his dirty little "order sixty-six" in them so that he could kill the Jedi off. Then Palpy became his apprentise, found out about the power, and killed Plaugeis/ Seiphodeas because he feared his power. Some of this is theoretical, but think about it- if the clones were created by a good Jedi to assisst in a forseen war, he probably wouldn't have implanted order sixty-six (What with him not wanting to kill them,and all)