Population Caps

[noian]

Bahh. Whatever happened to "epic battles" ?

I'm sure someone will be able to change the pop cap if we find it is too small.

[ralphman]

i´ve been playing a star wars mod for star trek armada 2 for the last 2 days and i come to the conclusion that the pop cap is not a bad idea......

in this mod i built a fleet of 30 star destroyers mark II and 2 superstar destroyer plus stardestroyers.... lancer frigates etc.... ... when i attacked the enemy it became such a chaotic situacion that i won by only sending the whole fleet right into the center of their base.

[Garbageben]

i´ve been playing a star wars mod for star trek armada 2 for the last 2 days and i come to the conclusion that the pop cap is not a bad idea......

in this mod i built a fleet of 30 star destroyers mark II and 2 superstar destroyer plus stardestroyers.... lancer frigates etc.... ... when i attacked the enemy it became such a chaotic situacion that i won by only sending the whole fleet right into the center of their base.

Exactly! There comes a point in making a fleet where you can no longer control your units effectively. Just sending X-dozen ships and moving them to the opposition base is not strategy. I like the pop cap because of the strategy involved with it.

[WhiteSkull]

thats called reall war.

[Garbageben]

thats called reall war.

I was referring to playing games not making "real war." In real war you have underlings to command troops and do things for you whereas in an RTS game you have to do it all yourself. Although it would be cool to have an "attack-move" order for units.

[Naja]

I imagine that a good mod would put the space cap at about 50-60.

 

That's about 20 capital ships (3x20), or however many support vessels you would want.

 

You could simply eliminate the presence of the other two fleets so that you wouldn't have to worry about that campy reinforcement aspect and just do battle with one fleet for each side.

[JanGaarni]

Just a small insert: A Capital Ship in Star Wars is any warship longer than 100 meters. So the Corellian Gunship (and possibly the Corvette aswell) would be considered Capital Ships.

[Naja]

My bad. By "capital ship" I meant something more to the effect of "ship of the line," like ISD, Mon Cal, VSD, all that jazz.

[lordstorm88]

hey guys I just found out at the official lucasarts site. if you look at the 13th screenshot. well the rebels' fleet doesn't look less than 20 pop to me... even if the cal are 2 and the rest are 1 pop its more!

 

unless if corvettes count for half or something.

[Lonegunman1947]

Well have anyone played Haegemonia? That games has bad ass graphics, really cool music and excellent sounds, but if you play it you will find out that all of that means nothing since the population is set to 5...

 

So 1 squadron of 6 fighters take 1 pop, or 2 cruisers take 1, but seeing how battleships owns all and only takes 1 pop, there is no point in producing anything else.

 

And also in Homeworld 2, there is no point in making anything but battleships. So the battles always consists of 25 battleships. Now the thought they had for population was a good idea:

 

30 Fighter squadrons Max Pop

25 Corvets Max Pop

25 Frigates Max Pop

25 Capital Ship Max Pop

50 Utility Ship Max Pop

 

But Battleships owns everything, excepth they dont hit fighter sqadrons very well, but for 30 fighter squadrons to take out one battleship takes hours. So whats the point in wasting resourses on anything but Battleships!?!

 

This is what i fear for Empire at War, all sides just puking out battleships.

 

I liked the population limit in SW Battlegrounds, but i like freedom to explore games, so in my oponion i think they should instead of just choosing one population cap, they can give us the choice to choose ourself. If you like huge maniac mass epic battles with no controll, u can have a population limit wich almost never ends, or if you like stratical skirmishes you choose low population limit. Giving us the freedom to expore the game and making the gameplay more variable is what makes a game truly great.

 

Thats one of the reasons why i consider Perfect Dark to be one of the best Fps console games ever, because their are so many things too choose from.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn 889]

look Delphi's already said and i agree that having this limited pop. cap means that you have to integrate fleets not just build as many Capital Ships As you can because building as many CApital Ships as you can puts the entire army at risk if the Enemy just brings there Bombers into play as its harder for then to be hit.

[WhiteSkull]

people keep forgetting the 'cost" of cap ships and the time it takes to build them.

 

Someone trying to build 6 ISD 18 pop cap worth could spend the same amount of time+credits that rebles could buy 3-4full fleets of mixed ships.

[Naja]

people keep forgetting the 'cost" of cap ships and the time it takes to build them.

 

Someone trying to build 6 ISD 18 pop cap worth could spend the same amount of time+credits that rebles could buy 3-4full fleets of mixed ships.

 

Yeah, but with 6 ISDs, the Imperial player could mass-produce TIE Fighters and Bombers (for no cost) to take out those fighters and destroy the heavier vessels' hardpoints while the ISDs hammer away at the support vessels.

[Faceh]

thats why this is gonna be a great game taking from the last few posts not just because its starwars but because I think it will be the most tactical RTS available you will have to think what your enemy will bring to the field and anticipate otherwise you will end up dead febuary can not come quick enough.

[WhiteSkull]

Yeah, but with 6 ISDs, the Imperial player could mass-produce TIE Fighters and Bombers (for no cost) to take out those fighters and destroy the heavier vessels' hardpoints while the ISDs hammer away at the support vessels.

 

Umm bombers? last time i checked ISD have a skill that can make tie fighters only and on a reuse timer, so your not gona mass make them for free as fast as you think.

 

 

plus you missed my point, with 4 fleets i am not going to fight your 6 ISD i am going to strike 4 planets while your hiting one of mine and will keep doing this.

 

And it will break you very fast.

[Matthujun]

As for being a 20 pop cap, it doesn't really bother me. 6 ISD is enough in one map, and from all the screenies that I have seen so far, they are pretty big, and too much would be too croweded in a map. Besides, unless ur computer is pretty good, the rendering might affect the gameplay. The only reason swgb's 200 pop cap worked was because every soldier took up 1 cap, and there weren't any official capital ships, except for the hacked ISD.

 

But then again, what about coruscant, the best defended imperial planet?

 

Just except for that, i'm pretty fine with it. Maybe raise it up a bit, but i say 30 max.

 

But to those who reallly want those huges battles, i have one thing to say to give you hope.

 

THe only hopes are either the devs give the players choice to choose the caps, or the extent of the game as in how much it could be modded.

[OMEGA]

Great news!

 

I just saved a whole bunch of time and stress complaining about the smallest things in the game that I don't like by switching to OPTIMISM!!!

 

NOW WHY DON'T SOME OF YOU TRY IT?!

 

It seems that all some people on these forums know how to do is complain about the aspects of the game they don't like, and say, "Oh, well the mods can fix that!". What makes you guys so totally sure that this game is going to be completely and utterly boring and uninteresting with the pop caps the way they are? The people at Petroglyph know what they're doing, and they wouldn't be changing things if it wasn't for the well being of the game.

 

The pop caps are just fine the way they are, and will offer the best mix of gameplay AND performance possible. Just have a little faith, and you'll enjoy the game no matter what!

[Garbageben]

THe only hopes are either the devs give the players choice to choose the caps, or the extent of the game as in how much it could be modded.

What if some of us think the pop cap is fine? I think the 20 + reinforcements is going to work fine. It leaves you with a decent sized fleet for *gasp tactical combat against the enemy. It's like PG said in an interview months ago that you could build a large fleet, but then there would be the whole "diminishing returns" scenario. There is no real bonus for massing ships because you can only bring out so many at a time.

[warhawj121]

i think the pop cap is fine as people have saiid it allows you to tailor your fleets to the mission. i think the game would get boring fast especially in mulit player if your oponent keeps throwing wave after wave of capital ships at you.

 

as i said in another post WH40k:DOW had it balanced perfectly. there was quite a low pop cap and high end units (IE terminators and landraider) cost a alot to prevent swarms of LR's being used as a god unit. if EAW turns out as well as DOW did it will definitely be my top game this year....

[Star Wars Man]

Great news!

 

I just saved a whole bunch of time and stress complaining about the smallest things in the game that I don't like by switching to OPTIMISM!!!

 

NOW WHY DON'T SOME OF YOU TRY IT?!

 

It seems that all some people on these forums know how to do is complain about the aspects of the game they don't like, and say, "Oh, well the mods can fix that!". What makes you guys so totally sure that this game is going to be completely and utterly boring and uninteresting with the pop caps the way they are? The people at Petroglyph know what they're doing, and they wouldn't be changing things if it wasn't for the well being of the game.

 

The pop caps are just fine the way they are, and will offer the best mix of gameplay AND performance possible. Just have a little faith, and you'll enjoy the game no matter what!

 

OMFG! Optimism! It burns! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

[warhawj121]

LOL star wars man!!! optimism?!?!?! we cant have that!!!!

[Star Wars Man]

LOL star wars man!!! optimism?!?!?! we cant have that!!!!

 

OMG don't say that word!! It's n00bish! We cannot have optimism, because optimism leads to the Dark Side

 

DON DON DON!!!

[warhawj121]

OK..

 

pessimist mode activated...

 

[Star Wars Man]

OK..

 

pessimist mode activated...

 

 

Okay, but what should we start complaining about?

[warhawj121]

after due consideration..........

 

i havent got a clue..