those whacky scientists...

[Jahled]

http://images.thetimes.co.uk/TGD/picture/0,,279642,00.jpg

 

What's freaked out about this picture is that it's NOT shopped...

 

Text: 'A pair of glasses rest on the 2 millimetre-long head of a housefly. Scientists were able to place the glasses with the help of special laser technology. The picture is part of an exhibition of science pictures on display in Munich.'

 

-The Times

 

Would be interested if anyone can actually link the article from the site; I found this linked from elsewhere...

[Guest Scathane]

Here it is...

[DarthTofu]

nothing to say on the matter. Edited March 19, 2006 by DarthTofu

[Jahled]

I can't deleate this post WHY? Edited March 19, 2006 by Jahled

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

Picks jaw up off of floor and after reconnecting it to his skull he utters one word...

 

WOW!

[Krytos]

Wow, that is impressive! !

 

Shame they don't say anymore in regaurds to how this "special laser technology" allowed them to put on the glasses or how they created the glasses that small (I assume including lenses).

[Guest Scathane]

I'll give you the grace of deleating such a stupid assement of progressive science, and will deleate this reply.

Er..., what?

[General_Crespin]

Now that... is cool.

 

Krytos, probably the same way they created the world's smallest guitar.

 

http://www.news.cornell.edu/photos/nanomachines/nanogtr.GIF

[DarthTofu]

WHY WHY WHY ARE WE DESIGNING THESE THINGS?!? We don't need them, they serve absolutely no purpose. If we could make a two micron long camera, maybe, that would be helpful, but a guitar? A pair of glasses? I'm not saying it was easy to do, and I'm certainly not saying I could do it, but its like running around in circles around a well before you get water! We aren't going straight to what needs to be built, that being the well in this analogy. Instead we run around in circles and design pointless little things that serve no purpose other than to look cool...

[Defender_16]

Practice makes perfect as they say.

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

If they are using this as a 'stepping stone' to nano-technology then I can see the use. Otherwise someone has too much time and someone else has too much money.

[Jahled]

Practice makes perfect as they say.

 

Emm... exactly, but I think your point is prooving elusive to someone...

 

WHY WHY WHY ARE WE DESIGNING THESE THINGS?!? We don't need them, they serve absolutely no purpose. If we could make a two micron long camera, maybe, that would be helpful, but a guitar? A pair of glasses? I'm not saying it was easy to do, and I'm certainly not saying I could do it, but its like running around in circles around a well before you get water! We aren't going straight to what needs to be built, that being the well in this analogy. Instead we run around in circles and design pointless little things that serve no purpose other than to look cool...

 

Right, to spare you any further humiliation dude, my guess is that you've approached all this without really thinking about it, but you're swiftly making a fool of yourself, so I shall try and point out what you haven't apparently grasped.

 

Do you actually think that scientists get funding from governments to make sunglasses for houseflies? Or make guitars in the hope that some housefly, whose lucky to be around longer than a week, is going to be the next Hendrix? What I linked was most likely the by-product of some other research along a simular vein; some scientist did in his/her spare time whilst working on something much deeper* Are you actually of the belief that some of the most educated people in the scientific community actually have nothing better to do than make sunglasses for houseflies?

 

Chill Tofu dude.

 

 

 

*Feels conspiracy theorists approaching....

[DarthTofu]

Honestly, these people obviously went to a very good college. This means that, rather than make sunglasses for a fly, they could actually get a paying job designing nanotech. with a purpose rather than a bunch of random, pointless trinkets.

[Jahled]

Honestly, these people obviously went to a very good college.

Like *doh*

 

This means that, rather than make sunglasses for a fly, they could actually get a paying job designing nanotech.

 

You haven't taken in anything I previously posted have you? What if they're already employed to design your 'nanotech,' but did the sunglasses, like I said in their spare time.

 

with a purpose rather than a bunch of random, pointless trinkets.

Pointless? They made us laugh and go wow, so what is your entire negative thing all about?

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

That's just Tofu's personality. Don't pay any attention to him, J.

[DarthTofu]

*sigh*, fine, you guys can go right on enjoying this, but I still won't understand how folks can get mad at U.S. Senators for building bridges between the Alaskan mainland and Inuit villages with a population of 50 and then not get angry about something like this ('Cause I honestly don't think anyone would allow a couple of scientists to use specialized equipment to manufacture sunglasses for the fun of it).

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

Look at it this way Tofu. You getting mad about it won't change anything. Me getting mad about it won't either. Not even if all 8 of us (8 different people have posted in this thread...) got mad about this nothing would change. Why waste your time being mad?

[DarthTofu]

I'll use your own logic against you, strictly for argument's sake: Will feeling bad about the Holochaust make it so that any fewer people died> Emotions are things we can't control. Perhaps I was gruff on this, but you folks know me- I'm not one to rant, usually... This just happened to be something I felt rather strongly about. Don't exactly know why I do, I just do. So there.

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

I'll use your own logic against you, strictly for argument's sake: Will feeling bad about the Holochaust make it so that any fewer people died> Emotions are things we can't control. Perhaps I was gruff on this, but you folks know me- I'm not one to rant, usually... This just happened to be something I felt rather strongly about. Don't exactly know why I do, I just do. So there.

No Tofu. Feeling bad doesn't change the past. I don't feel bad about what happened during WW2. I will do everything I can to prevent it form happening again. (This isn't much, I know, but it will be something IF it happens again.) I don't see how you are using my own logic against me, Tofu.

[Krytos]

Ok, before this gets out of hand I'll step in and give a whirl at expanding your view.

 

Ok, so these scientist guys are using new technology - so new, they're the one's developing it. So, as a developer you'll get to stages where you need to test the product - in this case test your theories and work on a creating something in nano. Now, I think it's safe to assume that this technology is very experimental, so we're not about to see them building a small robot or something that would impact on society (you'd hate to have some experimental nanotech blocking a cracked artery for it to fail because there hadn't been enough research into it).

Instead they will use the technology to develop something feasible, and as a test. Now, they could create a host of static objects. A perfect cube for instance. However, by creating something more challenging in shape (that being said I'm not sure how easy a "perfect" cube would be to make in nano) to test the full extents of the technologies you're working on.

Then there's a second thing to keep in mind, how often do we hear about this type of research? How do these researchers get interest to the public and other communities?

Well, the answer is what they did. By using the technology to create something the every day Joe will find amusing, thus increasing interest in the project (very important for any type of product), while at the same time testing the technology.

Granted a nano-guitar and glasses for a fly are useless (at the moment ) for anything. But creating those item did at least two things. Helped prove an experimental technology by creating difficult objects, and increase interest in the area - which could mean more research grants, more University students wanting to get into the field etc.

 

So, it wasn't a waste of money - it was a "showcase", a bit like a game engine in early development (if you've seen anything on the new Unreal Engine, you can put it into context with that. They're developing this engine - but why release a demo so early on? Why put hours into creating maps, model, textures and shaders when they're going to waste? Better yet, why are you watching it, drooling and waiting for the game to come out?).

 

Of course, I can see your point of view as well - that money could have been spent on something better and more useful for the present.

[Master_Xan]

To argue in favor of Tofu

 

A) Any nanobot used to repair arteries will have plenty of testing before seeing use in a human patient. No amount of practice creating glasses for a fly will impact the ability to create such a nanobot, considering that time could have been used to work on the nanobot instead, a more direct and useful method of learning.

 

B) As a showcase, this fails. First, not very many people will hear about it, and most of those who do are generally going to be the geeky/nerdy people that are looking for this stuff all the time and already know all sorts of things about nanotech. Second, of those who do hear about it and didn't know about nanotech before, the vast majority will say, "Wow, that's cool. I wonder how they got the fly to stay still?" or some other equally irrelenvent nonsense and then move on with life, having completely forgotten the entire thing in a day or two. (I'm going to assume the fly is dead, right?) Third, the group of people who see this and actually remember it will probably be small and fairly inconsequential. (Yes, a few people will see it and get interested, just not that many.)

 

C) As a proof of concept, this DOES have worth. Miniscule, but its there nonetheless. Businesses and governments already understand the implications of making things at this size, so there is no need to prove its usefulness. The ability to do so is useful, but I refer back to A and point out that you could make a non-functunal nanobot of the same size and complexity of shape, furthering your research and showing that something small and complicated can be made.

 

D) To really impress the public, they need something useful. This would gain far more media attention, even if its use is marginal. Say for instance a nanobot capable of walking. Its use is doubtful, but its a sure sign of progress. I could easily see a news story about such a 'bot, with interviews of designers talking about how they are currently working on making the 'bot capable of cutting hair so you don't have to shave (or whatever). Granted they aren't to the stage of making 'bots move around (at least, not that I'm aware of), but surely there is something useful they can make at that size. Perhaps the edge of a super-sharp drill bit, for instance.

 

At heart, I agree with Tofu. Its not very useful and would be time better spent on something else. As to whether they did this on their free time or not, I haven't the foggiest. If they did, then it's probably a great thing because it made them work when they might otherwise not have been, and is therefore furthering the science. If they did this during their normal work hours, then its not so good because they could do something else.

 

But really, I don't see why we should be getting all bent out of shape over this. This is by far not the worst waste of time or money no matter how you look at it, and so isn't really worth getting mad about. Just don't get me started on the usefulness of beer.

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

To argue in favor of Tofu

HOW DARE YOU?!?

 

If they did this during their normal work hours, then its not so good because they could do something else.

As someone who has spent work time on the forum I can say this. Nothing like speaking from experience is there Xan?

[Master_Xan]

Why the double post? Anywho, I figured somebody should stick up for poor Tofu over there, everybody was beatin' on the guy... Seriously though, I agree with him for the most part.

 

As for work hours... well, I suppose I could be doing something useful during my work hours instead of spending it here. But really, what is a salesman supposed to do when there's nobody in the store to sell to? That's right, post on online forums of course! In any case, I'm not using expensive equipment, nor am I getting paid to play on the computer. I get paid for selling things, so I'm not wasting anybody's money either.

[Mitth_raw_nuruodo]

Because my internet was being screwy when I tried to make the post. Also the delete post button isn't there to delete the double...

[HerrGeneral]

To be honest it really Pisses me off when you hear Storys like this. The world is plagued with famine and disease and these idiots want to spend time and money making tiny sunglasses to put on flys...!