Terrorists Threats

[dinochick]

What do you all think aout this? Do you think that this is really going to happen? Are you freaked out? Why are they telling us this now and do they know more than what they are telling us?

From MSN on Feb. 11:

 

"Top federal officials yesterday issued their most pointed advice since Sept. 11, 2001, on precautions the public should take against terrorist attacks, warning that every home should be stocked with three days’ worth of water and food in case of a strike with chemical, biological or radiological weapons. They also recommended that families consider designating a room where they will gather in the event of such an attack, and have on hand duct tape and heavy plastic sheeting to seal it, as well as scissors, a manual can opener, blankets, flashlights, radios and spare batteries. The officials said they believe the al Qaeda terrorist network is particularly targeting New York and Washington."[/b]

Edited February 12, 2003 by dinochick

[ricepr2001]

I think theres a possability but we dont need to get freaked out about all that.

 

For future reference its terrorism or terrorists not terror, different concept.

 

Its like people saying they ate McDonalds im like "What you talkin about ist still there."

[ElvisMiggell]

Well, due to the nature of my job, my building is currently on Black Special Alert, which basically means we're ready for any event that may transpire, but without having all the army guys nearby. In my job it's a constant threat. For example, we were hit with one of the anthrax parcels. As a government building we will always be a target. However, precautions don't dictate a need to be fearful, just to accept the facts as they are, and calmly evaluate the risks.

 

For your information if you didn't already know;

I work in the Asylum Screening Unit for Her Majesty's Government in Croydon. Most of you that live in GB will have seens things in the papers. For example, the pictures in the Sun about us providing coaches for them to sit in when it was minus4c. Also every time you see the pictures of the queues of asylum seekers, chances are that's Lunar House where i work. As such we are aware of the threat of terrorists posing as asylum seekers. It's actually a lot less common than you might think. Al Quaeda has more than enough money to fly their people in on business class and not have to bother coming in the cheap way. Each Asylum seeker is searched and scanned before entering the building, and we have a large contingent of well trained sucurity guards on site.

[Jahled]

Words of wisdom in times of panic, Elvis.

 

If only the media could sit back on think before they publish hysteria.

 

I salute you.

[ElvisMiggell]

Thank you. Although we are aware of the problems regarding asylum in general, and particularly concerning terror, we do find it a little frustrating when newspapers inparticular seek to slag us off without stopping to even acknowledge the amount of work that we do, and the rubbish we have to put up with, not to mention the smell!!! Seriously though, it's nice to hear that there are some sensible people out there.

[SWARMER]

Yes, there are some. I say that we not worry too much about terrorism. If we let it rule our lives, then it has already won.

[dinochick]

For future reference its terrorism or terrorists not terror, different concept.

 

Its like people saying they ate McDonalds im like "What you talkin about ist still there."

 

Sorry about that, but thanks for making me feel like an idiot

[ricepr2001]

Its just one of those things i cant stand, the worst part is a bunch of impotant people said it so now everyone does.

[ElvisMiggell]

Its just one of those things i cant stand, the worst part is a bunch of impotant people said it so now everyone does.

 

Hmmm, log, splinter, and eye spring to mind.....

 

Impotant = important or impotent?

[SWARMER]

he probably meant important, why does it bother you?

[Gank]

People should bear in mind that these new terror threats in the UK and US coincide with the build up against Iraq and may be just a propaganda attemp to bring a sceptical public into line, particularly in the UK. Then again they could be for real, most likely nobody will ever know but stationing troops in the airport isnt really going to stop anyone taking down a plane. Passenger jets are large slow and take a long time to climb out of range of a handheld sam.

 

As for media hysteria, one of the main storys on Sky news last night was a report on gas masks selling out, in an interview a man working in an army surplus store said he'd had a grand total of 5 phonecalls looking for one.

[ricepr2001]

Important. When I type fast some of my keys stick.

[UntimelyDemise]

People should bear in mind that these new terror threats in the UK and US coincide with the build up against Iraq and may be just a propaganda attemp to bring a sceptical public into line, particularly in the UK. Then again they could be for real, most likely nobody will ever know but stationing troops in the airport isnt really going to stop anyone taking down a plane. Passenger jets are large slow and take a long time to climb out of range of a handheld sam.

 

As for media hysteria, one of the main storys on Sky news last night was a report on gas masks selling out, in an interview a man working in an army surplus store said he'd had a grand total of 5 phonecalls looking for one.

 

I'm not so cynical. I think the threats are serious. But I think bin Laden is dead already and the message saying he will become a "martyr" this year is a ruse designed to hide this fact.

[Jahled]

I hope he's not dead.

 

Unless we know for sure where he is, dead or alive, we can't aim our gob.

[SWARMER]

i hope that he is dead. if not mabye he will kill milllions more to become a matyr

[Gank]

You may believe me to be cynical but I have serious doubts about the effectiveness in using tanks to defend an airport from a terrorist attack. A couple of mortars in the back of a transit (IRA in 1991) is enough to cause serious damage and is virtually unstoppable. Also remember Tony Blair just took a major hit to his attempts to start a war when it was revealed that an Intelligence report detailing how saddam was trying to decieve arms inspectors was copied word for word, spelling mistakes and all from a report a student wrote 12 years ago.

 

As for Bush, if you think that guy wouldnt lie to you to get you to back him then your either very niave or very stupid. Saying that you guys are pissing a lot of people off so I would think the danger of a terrorist attack over there is far greater than the UK.

 

Just for the record I live on the border between the north and south of Ireland and I've been through my fair share of bomb scares etc, which thankfully have stopped for the past while, however I'd like to point out that they didnt stop because enough people were arrested or killled. The more countrys you invade and people you kill, the more terrorists you're going to make. Until such a time as your governments address the cause of the terrorism your just going to have to live with these scares I'm afraid.

[UntimelyDemise]

I agree stationing military units at airports is useless. That's more a show of force than anything, just trying to make the public feel a little for comfortable.

 

I have to disagree with your last statement, however. The Irish situation is a little different than the Al Qaeda situation. I'm probably going to hear a lot about this, but both sides in the Irish conflict are rational, while Al Qaeda cannot be "bargained" with. What can the world give Al Qaeda that would make them stop killing innocent people? Osama Bin Laden and his organization have no demands...except the destruction of Israel and the US. But, lets say the world goes completely mad and Israel and the US are defeated...do you think they would be content? No. Britain and the other democracies in the world would be their next focus. Since Iraq is aiding Bin Laden and have the same goal of destruction as Bin Laden, they must be dealt with, too.

 

At least the Irish had something to negotiate. We can't just "talk" our way out of this. I wish everyone could see that. I think Bush and Blair aren't getting a fair shake.

 

What would you do if you were the leader of one of the two most powerful nations on Earth and there were people who wanted to kill your citizens just because they were alive?

 

By the way, the world tried to appease Hitler in the 1930s, and look what that did. We can't just stand by and let Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden turn into the next Adolph Hitler.

[ElvisMiggell]

IMHO

 

Both of you guys have got some interesting points. I'm not sure that Saddam is impossible to bargain with. I think you might be right about Osama though. Saddam in many senses is actually nothing like as 'bad' as Osama. Bear with me on this. Saddam is the legally elected leader of his country. No matter what people say about how the votes are unfair, the other countries in the world have recognised him as such. This means that what goes on in his country is his concern. It's quite alright for others to be concerned about it, but the law dictates that we cannot remove a legally elected representative. We can only do so if we have CONCLUSIVE proof that Saddam is harbouring ACTIVE terrorists.

 

This is where we hit the real crux of the problem. Colin Powell is trying to sort this out and find evidence. However, in today's media, 'the people' will not be satisfied with just being TOLD that there is conclusive proof. They want to see it. Now, most of my 'knowledge' in this area is garnered from books, but it seems common sense to say that if Powell were to present all the evidence as demanded by the public, he would have to reveal confidential sources. That's not on. It could easily endanger the lives of agents, or at least comprimise sources of information.

 

So what's the altenative i hear you cry. Well, our leaders could tell us that they have all the evidence and make us take their word on it. That's not going to work. The only chance we have is if every leader in NATO and the UN AGREES and does so publically. That can only happen if there are no ulterior motives. Not going to happen any time soon.

 

Some food for thought for you there. Also, Bush only just got the presidency, either he's done a very good job, or he's done a very good job of fooling a lot of Americans. I can't really see Bush not getting re-elected. Also, ignore Chiraq, IMHO he's useless. The man has been proved to be corrupt, he's almost certainly going to be charged as soon as he loses the presidency (a French President can't be taken to court during his tenure.) Finally, if indeed there are terrorists in Iraq, Saddam is giving them his tacit support by noit helping track them down and eliminate them. That last sentance is not a question of morals. Whether or not he agrees with their ideals, they are perpetrating crimes. THERE ARE NO EXTENUATING CIRCUMSTANCES FOR ILLEGAL ACTIVITY, ESPECIALLY TERRORISM. Saddam cannot continue to expect to be viewed favourably if he continues to harbour terrorists, even if he doesn't talk to or associate with them.

 

I'm sorry if that offends anybody, these are purely my personal views.

 

The current evidence, as is, is not enough to persuade me that WAR is the only viable option.

[dinochick]

As for Bush, if you think that guy wouldnt lie to you to get you to back him then your either very niave or very stupid. Saying that you guys are pissing a lot of people off so I would think the danger of a terrorist attack over there is far greater than the UK.

 

Thanks for that bit of enlightenment Gank, but I disagree with you on some points. Bush is a politician and he does what all politicians do, whether they are here in American or in Europe, or in the Middle East. It is the same everywhere. I personally do not want us to go to War with Iraq, I think that it is a job for the UN to decide, then if they decide that war is the ONLY rout to go, fine, if other countries have out back (as we have had theirs in the past).

 

But I think that is wrong of you to assume (if that is indeed what you are doing ) that because out president says some things to piss people off that we all do it over here, and therefore our danger of Terrorist threats is so much higher. If other countries would stop either hiding behind us to se what we do or would finally grow some"Ba||s" for themselves, this world would be a much better place to live in. Some countries stand up to terrorist and many do not. Its time that we all say that terrorist is wrong, and kick the a$$'s of those that will not listen!

[Gank]

Untimely demise, Bin Ladens boys are not fighting against Democracy, the west nor do they want to kill people just because they are alive. They are fighting the US because of the things the US has done and is doing in their part of the world. Yes they want to see americans dead, but they because of your governments policies in the middle east, not because you are westerners. They do have demands, get your troops out of their countrys and stop propping up Israel, but your country isnt going to meet those. nyways nobody here is worried about a terrorist attack and I seriously doubt Al Queda is ever going to threaten us. You americans like to think your protecting the world from a great threat but the reality is your just reaping what you've sowed. Sure Bin ladin would like to see the whole world united under the wahabbi islam banner but I think even the most deranged terrorist knows this isnt going to happen in a million years.

 

As for the US being defeated, we both know its not going to happen, your pretty safe over there behind your oceans, if the unlikely does happen and the US is beat out of the middle east, ask yourself, do you really care? Given the fact that the amount of oil your country uses from that region is minimal then the only real consequences are a loss of face and Israels possible defeat. But Israel has dug its own grave and cant possibly continue its existence at the rate its going, even with American support. Sharon is inflicting serious hurts on the Palestinian people and taking from my own countrys history these take a long time to heal.

 

As for my own country theres very few people here would describe either side in the conflict as rational, but your right in saying they arent the same thing. But violence begets violence and going into Iraq at the present moment in time is not going to make things better.

 

No offence but comparing Saddam or Bin Laden to Hitler is not particularly intelligent, neither have either popular support nor the economic base Germany had at his time. Bin laden hides in a cave ffs and saddam power was destroyed 10 years ago and unlike Germany hes been unable to rebuild it. There was no embargo on Germany in the 1930s neither were there weapons inspectors, in fact most governments knew hitler was rearming and did nothing. And nobody is trying to appease either of these men either and I dont know where you get the idea anybody is. To be quite frank I see more resemblance between Bush and Hitler and so do a lot of people outside the US. We even call Blair Mussolini down my local.

 

As for what I would do if I was the leader, I'd try to keep my people from getting killed, not put them at greater risk.

 

Now I dont support Saddam and Bin Laden, I think both should be taken out the back and shot with minimum of fuss, nor am I a pacifist, but going into Iraq without the support or blessing of the rest of the UN will only destabilise that region further and a lot of innocent people will die for no good reason.

[Gank]

Dinochick: Bush is a politician but he is not of the same sort we get around here, if the stuff that went on over there at the last election happened here Bush would be sitting in jail. And if any of our leaders went around saying stuff like "most of our imports come from foreign countrys" they'd find themselves shown the door fairly quick.

 

I didnt assume all Americans are like Bush either, however he is your leader and for some strange reason he has a high approval rating. So as long as he makes the decisions you people have to deal with the consequences. And America has lost an awful lot of respect worldwide since his rise to power, not just because of the Iraq issue, but on a lot of other issues like the Kyoto treaty, taxs on imports etc. This at a time when the US should be getting more suppport than ever.

 

And as for countrys hiding behind the US, please name them, nobody is hiding behind you, nor are they refusing to fight terrorism, you people are Al-Quedas target, and other governments are putting their own people in jeopardy helping you fight them. So spare us the sanctimonious bullshit about how you are protecting us, we're making ourselves possible targets by helping you. Do you have any idea how many US Troops have passed through my country recently? 10s of thousands. You owe us, not the other way round. Try and rememeber that next time we're helping you get oil, I mean fight terrorism.

 

Spare us the lets all fight terrorism speachs too, you dont know the first thing about it, some of us have seen the effects of it all our lives. Remember too one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter and both our countries were founded by "terrorists"

[dinochick]

Dinochick: Bush is a politician but he is not of the same sort we get around here, if the stuff that went on over there at the last election happened here Bush would be sitting in jail. And if any of our leaders went around saying stuff like "most of our imports come from foreign countrys" they'd find themselves shown the door fairly quick.

Obviously you have no concept of what took place here or you wouldn't be making an uneducated statement like that. There was noting criminal about what happened, therefore no reason for anyone, be it Bush or Gore, to go to prison. I guess we treat people a little better over here, which is why no one is in jail over that whole situation.

 

I didnt assume all Americans are like Bush either, however he is your leader and for some strange reason he has a high approval rating. So as long as he makes the decisions you people have to deal with the consequences. And America has lost an awful lot of respect worldwide since his rise to power, not just because of the Iraq issue, but on a lot of other issues like the Kyoto treaty, taxs on imports etc. BLAA BLAA BLAA BLAA BLAA

So spare us the sanctimonious bullshit about how you are protecting us, we're making ourselves possible targets by helping you..... You owe us, not the other way round. Try and rememeber that next time we're helping you get oil, I mean fight terrorism.

I agree with you on some points. I think that Bush should have signed the Kyoto treaty and I am sad that he didn't. But other countries should have still signed it even if we didn't (and a lot of counties didn't because they like to do what we do, whether it is right or wrong). Sorry, but we don't own any other countries anymore than some do us. So what’s up with that little remark! This fight is not only about oil, duh! We are not a country totally dependent on foreign oil.

 

Spare us the lets all fight terrorism speachs too, you dont know the first thing about it, some of us have seen the effects of it all our lives. Remember too one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter and both our countries were founded by "terrorists".

 

You are so full of bullshit. Why can’t you just answer a question instead of turning everything around? "got a problem...ohh, I know, lets blame it on the Americans, because they have more than us and are soo evil. I hate them so much" Get over it dude. I just wanted to have a conversation with people here. I didn’t come here to have you treat me and others like shit just for voicing our opinion, just like you did. So screw you. Its over. PEACE DUDE! I have noting else to say to someone like you.

[Gank]

Actually Dinochick I have read exactly what happened in florida on US government papers no less. And I feel totally safe in saying that the Irish high court would never have interrupted a recount in progress. Why? because if they had the people of this country would have been out on the streets. Just for the record 2 of our governments in the last 20 years have been brought down for scandals on a far smaller scale. Why? because we actually live in a democracy, and if the government does not have the peoples support it steps down.

 

As for the kyoto treaty, please name these other countrys that didnt sign it. But as you yourself have pointed out they didnt because yours didnt so the blame does fall on the US's shoulders. AS for the war not being about oil, of course its about oil, the fact that your country doesnt need it is pure fudge. Seriously, your going to install whoever you like in Iraq, will you buy oil off them at the same price your paying independant nations now? Use your head for fucks sake, iraq is the 5th largest producer of oil in the world and hasn't been able to sell its oil for 10 years because of a US imposed blocade. All this war is is a heavily armed robbery.

 

As for your last comments first off you never asked a question, secondly excuse me if I get offended when some yanks give big speechs on fighting terrorism when they're doing absolutely nothing to help solve the problem in my own country. There is one thing that really stands out in your answer though

lets blame it on the Americans, because they have more than us

What in gods name makes you think you have more than us? Big headed at the very least.

 

This is going downhill and I hope it doesnt get any worse but I'd like to remind you of one thing, you say its time to kick the asses fo all those who do not want to fight your fight, you do realise how many asses that is dont you? Because apart from your own country and the British government very very few people are on your side. I am not being anti american here, i am just trying to point this out to you and give you a few reasons why.

[Jahled]

Missile defense:

 

http://www.severin.ch/nmd/

[ElvisMiggell]

Um, guys, please, let's just calm down a little bit.

 

Dinochick: From where I am over here in England, the elction did seem a little odd. Now i don't know the technicalities, and I don't remember everything that happened and was said in the news. (And our news, even the BBC seems to be getting more and more biased anyway) But it did seem rather like Gore had it in the bag, just, and then Bush somehow won it. Now, it does strike me as a little odd that someone who barely scraped into power (that's how it APPEARS over here) should now APPEAR to be getting almost unanimous support in America. I know you guys take patriotism very seriously, and credit is due for that, but if nearly fifty percent of you didn't want him in power, shouldn't he be finding it a little harder to convince all of you?

 

Gank: Ultimately we'll never know what weight the oil situation has on this. I would say that it is a mighty convenient benefit that would result, but that goes for GB as well as the US. The situation in Ireland is complex, and let's face it, we all messed up on that one, both sides. However, Ireland was for a long time, and some would say, still is a warzone. The British army had a lot of troops stationed there, in effect an invasion. The reall difference lies in it being two faction within the area, whereas Iraq is an international conflict.

 

Everyone: The peace marches in GB attracted over 2million people yesterday. Now, with a population that big i know proportionally it's not that many, but i do think notice needs to be taken of the objections. It seems to me that Bush and Blair are just a little eager to rush into war. But so would any politician. A war like what would happen in Iraq would almost guaruntee re-election. So in many senses it's nothing personal, you'd expect it, which is why I'm suspicious of Chiraq and the other (can't speel their names, sorry).

 

I think we all need to calm down and try to think about this rationally, which is a very hard thing to do when media works the way it does, inspiring hysteria. Ultimately we elected our leaders more or less fair and square. We entrusted them to be responsible in situations like this. Blair and Bush aren't idiots, they don't want to send economically useful young men to die, nor do their consciences want it either.

 

Please, let's try not to get too personal.