Make carriers more useful

[tlmiller]

So, playing as the empire (but I'm willing to bet all factions have this issue), I noticed the escort carrier is more expensive than the Vindicator (24.1% credits, 59.1% neutronium, 38.7% lumite), is unarmed, has lighter shields, less hull strength, but only carries 1 additional fighter unit. In order to make it useful to actually have in existence, I'd suggest upping it to 4 or 5 fighter units instead of the 2 that it currently carries, or massively slashing the cost.

[Lavo]

That's an awful idea. Do you have any idea just how powerful it's Full Squadrons ability is? Have you ever even used it? It can be used to drastically shorten unit production times, or essentially make squadrons invulnerable while the ability is active.

 

For the Empire whose fighters are unshielded, this is a massive boon. A small number of these carriers can attain total air superiority over any enemy fleet as it's fighters just do not die. Additionally, it's the cheapest Full Squadrons ship in the game, both in terms of resource cost and supply. Keep those carriers away from the battle, where they are safe, and let them keep throwing fighters, or bombers, at the enemy.

[tlmiller]

That's an awful idea. Do you have any idea just how powerful it's Full Squadrons ability is? Have you ever even used it? It can be used to drastically shorten unit production times, or essentially make squadrons invulnerable while the ability is active.

 

For the Empire whose fighters are unshielded, this is a massive boon. A small number of these carriers can attain total air superiority over any enemy fleet as it's fighters just do not die. Additionally, it's the cheapest Full Squadrons ship in the game, both in terms of resource cost and supply. Keep those carriers away from the battle, where they are safe, and let them keep throwing fighters, or bombers, at the enemy.

 

Right now it doesn't do anything. They simply don't have enough squads to affect any battle where you're fighting anything bigger than a construction ship unless you use them in MASSIVE quantities. As is, they're just, useless... Even an invulnerable squad for a few seconds with only have 2 squads does...nothing. They're slow enough you get 1 pass while the ability is active, then they're back to being able to be shredded.

[Lavo]

I see then you likely have not seen someone, or even an AI, make good use of the ability, nor have you used it yourself much. In high pitched battles where fighters drop like flies at times, the ability makes a very, very big impact. The ability to speed up the construction of all ships at any planet, is also extremely powerful; on top of that the Imperials are the only faction with easy access to a Full Squadrons ship. The BAC and Liberator require research, while the Lucrehulk BB and Cluster Ship require being at level 5. Unfortunately, we must agree to disagree on this point, as I'm not willing to change the Escort Carrier, least it become grossly OP in the right hands.

[tlmiller]

That's fine, it's your mod. I'm just posting what I see. If I ever see it be useful, then that's fine. But in every game I've played, it made not one iota of a difference.

 

Although a question in regards to that. When you clone one as the Republic, does it get the abilities also, or just the basic stats? I forgot to look when I was playing as the Republic because I had cloned like a dozen of these things. And while I don't like the units, free units is free units, so I put them to use.

[Lavo]

The best use of the unit isn't as a front-line ship; I don't blame you for finding them useless. Unless you enjoy micromanaging kiting carrier fleets (a common tactic in vanilla Sins), I don't see people liking Escort Carriers much. Though those who can use them properly... Can be pretty brutal. That being said, a cost decrease may very well be in order.

 

When you get a ship, you get a ship, abilities and everything. As the Republic, getting a few of those is invaluable as the Republic has no units with Full Squadron; use 'em to speed up your ship production.

[tlmiller]

Yeah, I had tons of those, Vindicators, and the little corvette that I can't think of the name (the one you start out with 2 of as the Empire). I had more Imperial units in my fleets than I did my own units due to everyone getting killed off except my Praetors, and then I'd just pick up others as I went. I think my main battle fleet was 3 Praetors, 1 Venator colonization ship, 3 gladiators, 6 vindicators, 4 escort carriers, and more of those corvettes than I could shake a stick at.

 

That's awesome that you get to use their abilities. Next time I just need to convince them to clone some Tectors and an ISD-II-C...

[Lavo]

Thankfully, you cannot clone capital ships.

[tlmiller]

Thankfully, you cannot clone capital ships.

 

Ah, well that explains why I didn't get any.