Mick666 Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 Started playing on the latest feedback, going to do a full work up on my opinion on each ship, and what not. Started with the CIS. First off: Tradefed FRGs as cruisers? No idea what prompted that but they're still at frigate prices and damage. I use them like frigates, because the CIS now lack a combat frigate. Otherwise a fine addition to the fleet. The mines: these need a longer range. The homing mines need x3 the range, and the others +300 to make them even worth using. Right now its only good against planet bombers and structures. No defensive worth whatsoever- the homing mines have such short range that they almost never detonate.Also, there are two "Detect mines' abilities- but one destroys them. Consider renaming the one that kills em to 'Destroy Mines' to avoid confusion. Core ships: (the ones that are now frigates for some reason). These arent responding correctly to fleet attack commands. They respond fine to attacking ships, but only when i select them on their own. Also, a bug: I made a colony ship for the CIS attack a Gunship Analogue, which was about to crew a neutral extractor, then decided it was a better that it crewed first. Crashed the game- legit crash, no mini dump, just back to desktop in an instant. And may want to look at the spread of planets in random maps- got penned in by two v high level planets (One needed sector gov, the other needed Arcology Shielding II) adjacent to the first planet from the home world. I saw an AI with NO asteroids (i had one in a dead end lane) and two terran worlds next to it. Poor bugger couldnt even leave the home world for the first 20 minutes of the game. Game crashed, so expect more feedback after i have another game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 The TradeFed FRG is still a frigate. Don't forget; there is no "Cruiser" entity in Sins, just frigates. It absolutely does not matter what page a ship is on at all what so ever, as it does not change anything at all. As noted earlier in the thread, I moved ships around in order to make it easier to find out what each faction's scout, colonizers, anti-fighter, etc. are. I'll figure something out WRT mines. This is intentional. The Core Ship's primary purpose is to be a siege vessel, not a combat vessel. Normally I'd put in the Light frigateRoleType, which would "fix" this, and that's all, but then the AI wouldn't use the ship as well as it otherwise can. You mean the TradeFed AFC? I'll look into that. I should note that the second colonizers for most factions are full out combat ships that simply happen to have colonize/capture neutral extractors. Do you happen to have a save of shortly before this happened? I would really like to check that scene out. Are you playing on a regular random, or one of the Enlarged random maps? The latter was made to reduce the occurrences of such a case, and it does a relatively good job of it. Unfortunately, due to the nature of the random generator, it is not possible to get a perfect solution. If you're playing with AI, use an "Enlarged - Extra Planets" or "Enlarged - Quick" random map; this will make the AI perform significantly better. Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 Okay, didnt know that- gonna be a bit strange for a first time user of the mod. I personally liked the prior cruiser arrangement for the CIS, though (to me) the best frigate lay out would be: Geonosian Pinnance, Trade Fed, Patrol FRG, C9979, Hardcell, Diamond. Starbase constructors are in the cruiser menu normally, but it might be worth adding teh colonizing cruiser after the C9979. But thats just my view. Ah, that explains the Core Ship. Might be worth adding something about heavy bombardment guns or launchers to the desc to clear up any confusion- with the current 'even spacing of turbolasers' one can be forgiven for thinking its a front line ship. No save unfortunately- i have one thats all of 3 minutes into the game at the latest. No auto saves weirdly... Ill try recreate it. It was autocasting the crewing, then i stopped it, then sent back to crew (back = pivot). It was also being attacked by the gunship when i told it to retaliate. Regular random. Understandable that you cant control randomness. And im not sure i want the AI to do better- as is, i had them raiding my homeworld ten minutes into the game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 While I agree that the previous order was nice, this standardized order is better for new players and those unfamiliar with Star Wars in general. I'll figure something out for this as well. Yeah, it's the only ship in the game that has weapons in every single direction, allowing it to fire back at ships that are attacking it when bombing a planet. Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 While I agree that the previous order was nice, this standardized order is better for new players and those unfamiliar with Star Wars in general. Ah, so is this new order intended to be close to SoSE order or an original order of its own? If its the former, then just move the Heavy Constructor back to the cruisers menu and the TradeFed to the frigates, and place it after the Pinnace, and the two colony vessels before the Hardcell for it to be as close as possible.If its the latter, then its just something new and ill have to get used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 I suggest reading this post. This will be included in the next full release's ReadMe, should explain it well enough. I didn't follow Sins' order as it wouldn't make sense to people due to the amount of ships SoGE simply does not have (ex. LRM). Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 I suggest reading this post. This will be included in the next full release's ReadMe, should explain it well enough. I didn't follow Sins' order as it wouldn't make sense to people due to the amount of ships SoGE simply does not have (ex. LRM).That explains it, thanks. So effectively, we go the Cruisers tab for anything with firepower now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 Pretty much it, yeah. This way people can figure out the basics easily and focus on learning good fleet combos. Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 Pretty much it, yeah. This way people can figure out the basics easily and focus on learning good fleet combos.Alright. When can i expect this to be public? Ill need to rearrange the wiki. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted December 21, 2012 Author Share Posted December 21, 2012 Other point- why is there Assault Frigate Mk.1 worthy of being in the Capital Ship menu and the Mk. 2 only in the frigate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 (edited) Due to there being no other ship being fitting to be the Alliance's siege vessel. It's capable of both being a combat ship and a siege vessel, even in "frigate" form. It's mainly there as the AI dies when it doesn't have a siege frigate. Unless of course you are referring to there being an AAF Mk.I and Mk.II. If so, I note that the Mk.II was made purely for EaW; we've re-purposed it to be a different ship that uses a model based off of said ship. In SoGE it's a powerful frigate, versus the AAF Mk.I which is a powerful cruiser comparable to the Dreadnaught. Also, the wiki as it is now has the correct order; the TradeFed Munitions AFC-H is truly a cruiser for example, even if it's on the first build page. Edited December 21, 2012 by Lavo Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted January 5, 2013 Author Share Posted January 5, 2013 Noticed that there are two Assault FRG Mk.1's in the Alliance menu, one in the frigate menu and one in the Capital menu. Theres also the Mk. 2 in the Cruiser menu. Same stats apply to both, only one has a reduced cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Both of the Assault FRG Mk.I units have the same cost; you must be on an old revision if they do not. The sole reason duplicates of this unit exist is so that Alliance players, and the AI in particular, have access to a cost-effective siege frigate. The Mk.II, whose model is the same as the EaW unit of the same name, is an entirely different unit than the Mk.I; the only thing remotely similar is their names. You literally mentioned both of these points two posts up from yours, I'm not sure why you are mentioning them again. Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted January 5, 2013 Author Share Posted January 5, 2013 Both of the Assault FRG Mk.I units have the same cost; you must be on an old revision if they do not. The sole reason duplicates of this unit exist is so that Alliance players, and the AI in particular, have access to a cost-effective siege frigate. The Mk.II, whose model is the same as the EaW unit of the same name, is an entirely different unit than the Mk.I; the only thing remotely similar is their names. You literally mentioned both of these points two posts up from yours, I'm not sure why you are mentioning them again.I just mentioned thye Mk. 1 again because i did so in a different post, and you mentioned it was a bug and would remove the non-capital version. I'm running the latest- so i probably misread the card. And i'm not entirely sure why i mentioned the Mk. 2... If both Mk. 1s exist, what reason would there be to get the frigate menu one? Especially if both have the same cost. Might be easier- and less confusing- to just have the cap ship one. A Rebellion exclusive benefit, can't hurt. Just an idea- or does the AI require a bombing frigate? Im going to shut up now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 If there was only a capital ship one, the AI would die. It's performance would plummet. The AI does in fact require a siege frigate, which is why there are two of these ships to begin with. Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted January 13, 2013 Author Share Posted January 13, 2013 The New Order tech is not in the tree, can't research it or any that require it. The Heavy Ion Cannons ability for the cruisers that are made in the Cap Factory (Vic II, Imperial II are two I know of) for the Empire don't require the Heavy Ion Cannon tech to work, but those on the actual Caps that can acquire them, do. Also, there's one tune in the music line up that sounds more like an Elder Scrolls Daggerfall tune than a SW one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavo Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Fixed on my working version. Intentional; some descs need fixing. Sins of a Galactic Empire staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick666 Posted January 17, 2013 Author Share Posted January 17, 2013 Torpedo Volley has no req in the desc, but needs a tech. The NR 6 level reduce tech thingy has 'the Alliance' instead of the 'NR' in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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