Defender class Star Destroyer

[Krytos]

Back again, and with a new model in the bag. The New Republic's Defender class Star Destroyer and the Endurance class Fleet Carrier. All modelled, all textured - now I jsut need to try it in game

 

DSD:

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/8391/dsd082ua.th.jpghttp://img354.imageshack.us/img354/6411/dsd018gw.th.jpghttp://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8996/dsd028lb.th.jpghttp://img221.imageshack.us/img221/1113/dsd070it.th.jpg

 

EFC:

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/8342/efc15dt.th.jpghttp://img147.imageshack.us/img147/2202/efc27ve.th.jpghttp://img147.imageshack.us/img147/7600/efc31ak.th.jpghttp://img147.imageshack.us/img147/9923/efc42qq.th.jpg

[Mad78]

Very Very nice.

 

What is the Poly count?

Edited November 9, 2005 by Mad78

[DarthTex]

Super cool Krytos! With lots of new cool models like these, there should be some really decent looking fleets flying around.

 

Mad78, did you mean "poly count"?

[Mad78]

***Mad blushes and edits his post***

 

My mistake. Will teach me to read something about Photoshop all while posting on the forum.

[Defender_16]

*Just about falls out of chair backwards*

 

Holy cow! That came outta nowhere. Um... wow, give us all some warning when you're working on a new model like that sometime. I just about had a heart attack.

 

Great model. Can't wait to try it out.

[AdmiralToguroAni]

Great job! I can't wait to use the fleet carrier in my game!

[Krytos]

Well, good news and bad news . . . no wait, mainly bad news

 

The model has a poly count of just over 2000 faces, closer to 2100.

 

Bad news: Tried it in game and . . . well, ugly. I fixed up a lot of the model problems, though I've got a huge texture problem. The textures white, yet the model is a dark grey with a lot of anomolies in the texture, such as green areas and no blues or reds

I'll post some pics soon of what it looks like soon

 

I think I'll be getting in contact with the all mighty Mask and beg for his assistance, as I had simular problems with my last model - the Belarus (including some texture areas that made the ship transparent)

 

*starts warming up the begging pose*

 

EDIT:

Oh yeah, D16 - I've already got in the works the following models from a few months ago:

Defender Carrier (slightly modified Majestic)

Sacheen Frigate

Hajeen Fleet Tender (Sacheen modified - no idea to what yet)

Warrior Gunship

Agave Picketship (you guessed it, modifed model of the Warrior)

Ranger Gunship <- Making the entire mesh from scratch, no primatives at all!

 

and some others that dont spring to mind at the moment.

[AdmiralToguroAni]

Nice. You forgot the "Firefly class cruiser" used by the, uh, Smuggler's alliance and captained by Malcolm Reynolds, who is an associate of, uh, Han Solo, and appears sometime after the Vong war. Yep.

 

I'm just kidding. I'm actually just anxiously awaiting the Serenity model. In regards to your above models, they're really nice looking. I've been impressed with your work since I saw the Majestic. Very nice model and I'm sure the others will all be the same.

[Mad78]

COuld you email me the model and the textures or contact me via msn. Maybe I can give you a hand with solving your problem.

[Krytos]

Here it is, in all it's ugliness

 

I'll send it to you as well Mad, hopefully we can fix it

 

http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/2246/dsd2ka.th.jpg

[DarthTex]

Krytos wrote:

 

... I think I'll be getting in contact with the all mighty Mask and beg for his assistance, as I had simular problems with my last model - the Belarus (including some texture areas that made the ship transparent)

 

 

OOOooowww, a ship with a "cloaking device" , how cool I would show you some of my cloaked ship models, but ... they're invisible and I can't find them

 

Good luck with the fixes

[the_mask]

Hmm, inverted faces, you say ... hmm.

 

Sure, fire it my way and I'll take a look at it. Btw, I just remembered something likewise

[Floros]

Well, I have the same problem. My models look nice on my 3D programm, but when I insert them in the game, they look ugly. Too bad the Rebelion-engine is sooo primitive...

 

http://img492.imageshack.us/img492/6746/ships27qr.jpg

 

So far I have constructed the "Firespray", "Arc-Hammer", "Moldy-Crow" and the "Invisible Hand". I have tried many times to load them on the models-section, but failed. Maybe I can email my .rmd files to someone else to post them for me?

[Mad78]

I can try and Upload them for you. WHat kinda problems do thay have ingame?

[Floros]

They don't have a problem, they just don't look equally good in-game, as they look in the 3-D program... They loose some of their color and detail.

I'll email them to u shortly...thanx Mad78

[the_mask]

Look for overlapping faces and the right palette in the texture, Mad

[Krytos]

Ok, well I figure out my overall problems with textures and now have a working version of the EFC.

So due to bordem and the fact I can;t be bothered at the moment working on the model any more - I'll release them both tomorrow as an early version and in the future I'll attempt to remake them as a better version.

Speaking of which, I've recompiled the textures for the RSD, Vong Cruiser and Balarus with the fixed technique - and am currently thinking of what to do with them . . . get someone to test to see if they're worth while, upload a new texture pack or a new model.

[Krytos]

Bump!

Models are uploaded and ready to go:

 

DSD:

http://www.swrebellion.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=getit&lid=117

 

EFC:

http://www.swrebellion.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=getit&lid=118

 

Suggested stats-

DSD:

Hull: 2750 Shields: 600 Recharge Rate: 25

Hyperdrive: 60 Sublight: 7 Maneuverability: 2

Troops: 1 Fighters: 5

&&&&&&&&&For | Aft | Sides | Range

Turbolasers: 242 | 242| 242 | 70

Ion Cannons: 20 | 20 | 20 | 50

Tractor Beam: 3, 20

 

EFC:

Hull: 3250 Shields: 300 Recharge Rate: 25

Hyperdrive: 60 Sublight: 7 Maneuverability: 1

Troops: 1 Fighters: 12

&&&&&&&&&For | Aft | Sides | Range

Turbolasers: 28 | 0 | 28 | 65

Ion Cannons: 20 | 4 | 4 | 50

Laser Canons: 25 | 25 | 25 | 25

Tractor Beam: 2, 25

[AdmiralToguroAni]

They both look good. However, the EFC is turned around. It actually flies backwards!

[Krytos]

They both look good. However, the EFC is turned around. It actually flies backwards!

 

 

I thought I'd remembered to fix that

Umm, I'll fix that ASAP!

 

EDIT:

Sorry all, I should have checked that befoer I uploaded it

I think I've fixed it - try downloading it again. If it's still backwards tell me so I can fix it again

[shinsengumi]

After having posted a note about Defender-class Star Destroyers in the Majestic-class Cruiser thread, I noticed that there was already a DSD thread, so I guess I should have left my comment here instead.

 

This is a nitpicky point, but contrary to what has become accepted as conventional wisdom, the Defender-class Star Destroyer does not exist in the Star Wars universe. The source trilogy and the author's notes clearly indicate that the New Class Star Destroyer is designated the Nebula-class, after the first vessel of the class. This originally arose from a misunderstanding on the part of a West End Games writer, who then, thinking that there were three New Republic starships given the "Defender" designation (a starfighter, an assault carrier, and the unintentionally misnamed star destroyer), then made up a rationale for the naming scheme.

 

In all honesty, the Black Fleet Crisis trilogy seems to be among the less popular of the extended universe novels, and therefore most looking for information on the New Class vessels have gone straight to Cracken's Threat Dossier for information, bypassing the novels entirely. Because WEG never had the chance to publish errata before it lost the licence to publish Star Wars Roleplaying Game material, the incorrect name has stuck.

[AdmiralToguroAni]

dang, thats nitpicky.

[Krytos]

Hey shinsengumi, and first off - welcome to the forums! Always happy to have someone come along, especially when they have information to share.

 

Most of my info on the EU comes from varied sources. Most local bookstores and even libraries don't stock too much Star Wars novels or otherwise (with exception of the NJO series).

It's been a long time since I've gone though the Black Fleet Crisis, and due to my libraries lack of SW books, it wasn't in order. So, I'm not going to dispute any of your claims - actually commend you on gathering the resources together effectivelly.

 

 

I've read on a few occations what you're talking about regaurding the NSD - and also tend to agree. At the same time, I read an article that swayed me to the "other" side (wish I could find it again ).

All in all, I'm still gonig to call it a DSD (even though confussing), mainly because I like the name as well. Also, to note, is that the semi-rescently released Starships of the Galaxy, list it as a Defender class Star Destroyer with D20 stats that puts it in a little stronger, and more manouvreable than with the D6 stats, fueling the argument that the NSD and DSD are two different ships, with the DSD being a more modern version of the NSD.

Of course, that's loopholed with various arguments - like why create a new class rather than upgrade the old etc.

Of course on a technical point someone once mentioned, it could be argued that it should be the "Obi-Wan" class SD as the first vessel of the series was called the Obi-Wan . . . semantics really.

 

In the end, it's your choice - and seeing that the models are now available, and you've probably got Rebellion, it's a simple process of modifying stats and names to suit.

 

Of course, in the real end it's lucas owneth, and lucas changeth. Such as the original K-Wing, the "official" version has its own laser cannons whereas the original didn't seem to have any defenses. Most of the ships seem to get tinkered later to both better suit the universe, and more importantly to the tinkers, to fit gaps in the RPG stats tables.

If you go by the NJO novels, the New Republic doesn't seem to have any of the "new" class vessels, and the only new ships they use are of that era - BACs, Mediators etc.

On the fighter side, E- and B-Wings are rare and Y-Wings are still in service. X-Wings are everywhere while K-Wings and Defenders aren't even mentioned.

In fact, in Destiny's Way, they're still using MC80b's. One problem with LucasBooks, is there doesn't seem to be enough information and guidelines given to writters in the regaurds of ships. The author of Destiny's Way commented on this too, saying if he'd known of later ships in the SW universe, he'd have added them in. But he only had the books form the NJO series as well as the first Essential Guide to Vehicles (or whatever it's called).

It's become obvious in the later series that there's a lot for the reader to fill in, as in the case of the NJO it seemed to be better tailered to unfamilur readers of the EU.

How this applies back to the CTD and its content, really is only how you view it.

Like you point out, k-mac essentially created these vessels, so perhaps we should be following what he set out. On the other hand, it is Star Wars, and if they release "official" or even, newer and more offical information, should we go by that?

 

I'm half a sleep here after finishing uni at 7:30 pm and getting home . . . dont recal when . . . so, I'm not entirely sure that my argument made sense let alone is an argument.

[shinsengumi]

All in all, I'm still gonig to call it a DSD (even though confussing), mainly because I like the name as well. Also, to note, is that the semi-rescently released Starships of the Galaxy, list it as a Defender class Star Destroyer with D20 stats that puts it in a little stronger, and more manouvreable than with the D6 stats, fueling the argument that the NSD and DSD are two different ships, with the DSD being a more modern version of the NSD.

It's funny, isn't it, how a mistake, left uncorrected, goes and takes a life of its own. I disagree that the DSD indicated in the Starships of the Galaxy is a different vessel, because of two things. First of all, the concrete specifications of the two are just about identical (the D20 sourcebook rounds off the crew size to the nearest thousand and uses a value of 6 months instead of 5 for the consumables, though everything else, from cargo capacity and passenger capacity down to the exact number of weapons is identical). Second of all, doing conversions from D20 to D6 tends to result in inflated figures, particularly for damage, something that Gary Astleford noted in his extensive D20 to D6 conversions and something I found out myself when I tried my own hand at doing conversions when the Revised Core Rulebook came out.

 

As much as the Nebula-class designation is the correct one, I know that the incorrect Defender label will not go away, as the snowball has gotten so large and has gained so much momentum that a little twig like me has no chance of stopping it. My aim in bringing up this point here was not to try to get you to change the name of your ship, but just to help spread awareness that in fact in the novels where the particular vessel originally appeared, they were designated Nebula-class Star Destroyers, and that the background material written by WEG and WotC writers for their DSDs is largely material they whipped up themselves to try to flesh out the lie that they were unwittingly perpetuating.

 

In short, don't take my words too seriously, but rather think of it more as trivia than anything else.

 

Cheers!

[Krytos]

The Defender is undoubtably the same, or originally the same, ship as the NSD. My little rant there was just one way fans have tried to justified the existance of both ships.

 

I like some continuity in the EU cannon, so I generally try to fill in the gaps. My own personal answer to try and resolve the issue (as opposed to the two seperate ship classes that are almost identicle, as well as just writting off the DSD), at least for myself, to make both sides of the argument sort of follow through.

Simply put, the NSD was the original ship, however considering the NR only produced the ships in limited numbers a constant upgrade scheme wouldn't be out of the question. Newer technologies allowed the NSD to later be upgrade to house additional consumables and other resources, additional fighters etc. The time these changes came into effect, the NR was already downsizing the navy and in an effort to keep the focus of these impressive warships as a vessel intended on keeping the New Republic safe from those who would attack her (and to stop the buracrats condeming the waste of resources to large warships that could be replaced with smaller vessels as they seemed to do with so many others) the vessels class was re-named to Defender. The change of face stopped the decomissioning of the series, as well as continuing construction fo these mighty warships.

It's rather pointless, though for me at least makes some continuity in my mind at least.

 

In the end I tend to agree with practically everything you say. And, as even the newer stats point out, it's practically the same ship with only a handful of upgrades which hardly warrents a new ship or any change to the original designation of of the Nebula SD. Though the new stats do make the the NSD/DSD a much more capable warship, which helps considering its numbers versus Imperial ISDs.

Even in a straight up fight against an ISD mk II (weapons and armour only), I'd say the new NSD would win - add that to it's better speed and manouvreability and you've got a highly capable warship that would be meanacing to all but the largest of warships. Strong, powerful, difficult to hit with large salvos and it's capable of exploiting an opponents weakness.

I rather liked a few other changes that the Starships of the Galaxy book brought out, such as allowing large warships to have Point Defense Lasers, even if not mentioned. The main benefit to this, is the fact that if you look at the armourment of some Episode III, they seem to be armed with a large number of weapons - but a lot of those are PDLs, making the "newer" ships seem less impressive. The only annoyance is that it doesn't say how many to give to vessels or give a rule on how to calculate it

 

 

Just a suggestion to, you might try creating ship cards for the game for the new class ships (I'm assuming you know about Rebellion a little here). That way, you can spread the truth a little more

I'm pretty sure that there aren't any cards for the EU ships I've made - except the Majestic I think. I havn't made any, and I'm currently just trying to get time to fix my new majestic design. But, feel free to create your own cards with descriptions, stats and names for them