Thoughts on Revenge of the Sith -- Long

[JarodSliverstar]

Hi Folks. Been a while since I spoke up in the forums here but saw EPIII the other night and just wanted to give a couple of my own opinions. I know other people have started their own threads on this as well, but just had things running around in head and needed to get them out.

 

Overall I thought the movie was rather good, but not great. I had tried to avoid spoilers as much as possible, but you can’t help but learn some of the details. But I managed to avoid a good bit of knowledge, so I had a number of surprises in how things happened.

 

Here is how I felt about parts of the movie:

 

Space Battle above Coruscant: A little disappointed. For the most part the battle felt empty. Obi-won and Anakin spend a lot of time flying but not really seeming under threat. Yes, there were clone pilots that were fighting off-screen but more risk to the Jedi would have been better. I do like how easily Anakin shakes the missiles, showing his skill as a pilot, where Obi-won has more trouble. A larger view of the overall battle would have been nice too. Would have given you more of an impression that this was major event, unless you had seen the cartoon Clone Wars, you just get the impression there are a few ships there. As it was, much of the sequence seems to have been simply to show off special effects. Including the ‘crashing’ of the ship at end of that battle.

 

Fight with Count Dooku: Not too bad actually. I would have liked Dooku to maybe taunt Anakin a little more. Dooku’s look at Palpatine at the ordering of his death was great.

 

Transitions: For the most part this was done well. The setting of Anakin on the Jedi Council was mostly done well. I did pick up on Anakin complaining that nobody but Jedi Masters sat on the Council, but I remembered a reference to a Jedi Knight on the Council back in Episode I. Just another sad example of Lucas rewriting his own stories after the fact. I can only guess he was thinking to use it as a plot device to give Anakin another reason to turn against the Jedi. The scenes with Anakin and Padme were much smoother than in Episode II, so I won’t complain about them. A better sense of the passing of time would have been nice, even if it was dropped hints in the dialogue.

 

The Turning of Anakin: Like some other reviews I have seen, I feel it happened a little too quickly and completely. Palpatine wisely used Anakin’s dissatisfaction with the Jedi training process and the threat to Padme as lures to his side, but the key point was the confrontation with Mace Windu. I think that if Mace had not started that final attack to kill Palpatine, but stepped back and said, “Anakin, you are right. Killing him is not the Jedi way.â€

[Jacen_Fel]

Interesting thoughts, I personally thought the opening scene was fine and am glad they didn't make it any longer. They didn't seem be in great danger because they had that wing of fighters watching their backs and keeping everyone off them for the most part.

 

You didn't mention it but I thought the action with R2D2 beating up on those droids was great !

 

Dooku's taunt to Anakin saying he was twice as powerful by saying that his fall would be twice as hard wasn't enough?

 

As for Anakin turning too quickly? We saw hints of him going towards the Dark Side in Episode II and in Episode III his "turning" started with striking Dooku down near the start of the movie and took nearly the whole movie with the Mace thing at the end and him then deciding to learn the powers of the Dark Side. They couldn't have dragged it out more unless they had him turn after fighting Obi-won which obviously wouldn't have worked .

 

I assumed Grievous gasping had something to do with the apparently organic body parts he had under his droid makeup? Like maybe a venilator similiar to what Vader later had just less advanced hence the noises it made.

 

I thought killing the younglings in the temple by Anakin had to be done... Anakin had already killed children before in Episode II (The Tusken children after his mother died he slaughtered everyone in their camp). Plus seeing video of it was about the only way Obi-won would be convinced that he had turned. He had turned... the Jedi would want him killed therefore even youngling Jedi were a threat to him .

 

I thought Order 66 was great as well, I kept wondering how Anakin would get around to all those Jedi's. I must say having the clones programmed to do it at the right time made ALOT more sense .

 

It's also possible Yoda was tired before their fight... he did just clear a path through alot of guards at the Jedi Temple to change the transmission it was sending out. But yea, Yoda is the only Jedi they've ever shown deflecting force power with his hands so I think that says enough about his power .

 

You do have to wonder if years later, Obi-won ever kicked himself for not finishing Anakin off right then and there, instead of just walking away intending to let him die of the injuries.

 

He did... well actually Vader did... in Episode IV when they fought on the Death Star Vader made a reference that Obi-won should have finished the job on (whatever that planet's name was). I forget the exact quote... as its been a while.

 

I also thought Padme should have died from the injuries Anakin inflicted on her... but maybe that was still the point they were trying to convey... regardless the Emperor told Anakin she died because he killed her in his anger so as far as he's concerned that's what happened.

[Darthronar]

Grievous gasping comes from the Clone Wars cartoon. Windu wounded him.

[Darthronar]

And Anakin held back i think with Padmé. Palpy lied about him killing Padmé to topple him over into darkness 100 percent.

[BadSamaritan]

http://media2.big-boys.com/bbfiles/images/bbpics/pic1084.jpg

[Aenivae_Ikeda]

I agree with some of the things you said Jarod, but not all.

 

I too liked the battle with Dooku, especially Anakin disarming him. And the death order, that was great.

 

I didn't like the turning of Anakin either, way to fast for him to bow over. Perhaps if Palpatine had fed him a few lies, and then Anakin crumbled and cried, and then slowly pledged himself.

 

For grevious... I hated it. He made a mockery of him and I expected him to be kicking ass through the movie. Although I do like when Kenobi jumps down and says "Hello". As for the blaster, he says. "It is an elegant weapon, not as clumsy or random as a blaster." I think.

 

For the Jedi Knights, I think that they were unprepared for battle and maybe Palpatine used some sort of Stun through the force to get through them quickly, which may explain why Windu bested him so easily. Maybe he used too much energy to get rid of the three Knights and then was sapped. But I believe he knew Anakin would come. Why else would he let him leave after revealing to him that he was a Sith Lord?

 

The Jedi temple attack disappointed me. I too expected Anakin to do some ass-kicking. Although the children did hit home with me, as much as I hate them...

 

Order 66, ouch. Well done I think. The pure look of shock and horror on Ki-adi Mundi's face when he turned around was priceless. Poor guy had the Droids shooting at him from behind and the clones from in front. Plo Koon's death pissed me off, I expected him to put up a badass fight... Damned Jedi Starfighters...

 

As for Obi-Wan giving up on Anakin so easily I wasn't surprised. In episode one Obi-Wan is able to beat Darth Maul because he is pissed as hell, which shows that Ob-Wan gives into anger. I imagine he would have been quite angry about the Jedi Purge, and would have wanted revenge. So I believe it was in Obi-Wan's character to do what he did.

 

Yoda and Palpatine. People say it was dumb because Yoda didn't kick his ass. If you watch the movie, where order 66 comes into play, you will notice Yoda looking hurt as the Jedi die. I attribute his loss to that. Having been sapped of energy or something.

 

I liked when Obi-wan just walks away from Anakin, kind of symbolizes that Obi-wan is leaving him behind, and that he is over with him.

 

I didn't like Padme's death but the "will to live" thing does make sense. The love of her life just tried to kill her and has gone against everything she believes in. While you could argue that she should live for her children, I think she died of heartbreak. Like the dog in "Where the Red Fern Grows".

[JarodSliverstar]

Thanks for answering, everybody has a valid opinion and I like hearing them.

 

I just wanted to come back to one point. Anakin killing the Jedi childern in the attack on the temple. Sure, he needed to do it, but the 'reasons' for killing them are fuzzy.

 

Remember, up to the beginning of this movie, the Jedi are protectors of the weak and all that. Anakin still saw himself becoming one of them, even if he believed he was destined to be the greatest of the Jedi. He had his issues with the Jedi Council, but not with the majority of the Jedi order itself.

 

Then comes the confrontation between Mace Windu and Palpatine that is the turning point for Anakin. Sure, that situation allows him to disarm (or is it dis-hand?) Windu, but does it turn him into to a killer of children in that instant also? After all, by his training up to this point, protecting people has been his role. Why does he decide, within hours at most, that even Jedi children are a threat to him and need to be destroyed?

 

Does the novel explain this a little more? I have not gotten a chance to pick it up yet, but will soon.

 

The only thing I can think of at this point is that somehow Palpatine was able to brainwash Anakin into becoming a Jedi killer the same way the Clonetroopers were implanted with Order 66.

 

Any insight that you folks what to share?

[Skynxnex]

Well you have to remember now, Anakin is/was consumed by the dark side. We know that the dark side is essentially like a drug and once someone is consumed by it, it is hard for them to let go of it. Also, one should consider that killing the children prevents them from becoming a threat later. If you were a jedi child and you saw a jedi knight turned Sith Lord slaughtering everyone and you escaped more than likely you would want to seek revenge.

[Aenivae_Ikeda]

Did I mention in my post that Hayden still sucks at acting? That's one of the major turn offs for me in the movie. And the worst part is that Hayden had acting lessons for each scene from professionals, actors, even Ewan... God the guy is hopeless...

[Prine]

I have no idea what the Clone Wars cartoon is, I suppose we don't get it here, so General Grievous made no sense to me. I hate to flog a dead horse, but there were so few decent actors in these films. The two that stood out in this one were Ian McDiarmid (Palpatine) and Ewan MacGregor. MacGregor's Obi-Wan was really good here, I think he's probably the best overall actor out of all three films. Christensen and Portman are as hopeless together here as they were in Attack of the Clones. What else... another pointless reference to the first three movies, Chewbacca makes an appearance. Meh. C3PO didn't need to be in any of these films, either. R2D2's amazing droid-ninja skills inexplicably continue. "Younglings" is a stupid word, though I'm aware it was also in Attack of the Clones, and Anakin's fall was too much too fast (yes, we know Vader's cruel, but evidently not irredeemably so, so why demonize him by having him needlessly kill kids?).

 

All those complaints aside, I think the relationship between MacGregor and Christensen was much more refined in this movie, and even though I don't think much of him, Christensen put in an admirable effort with a fairly complex character given the time constraints and rough script. The dialogue was generally not great, but it was more evenly spaced out and generally employed better here than in the last film. It tied many loose ends up nicely, and at least we got a few nifty looking Jedi fight scenes. It got me jonesing for Star Wars again, so it must've done at least a few things right.

[Jahled]

What I haven't enjoyed seeing in the last two prequals was the 'cartoonish' Jedi fight sceens we were spared in TPM; I mean, I appreciate Yoda being 3ft tall poses a problem in a fight, but the sheer extent of the leaping about was more akin to rather over the top Hong Kong martial Art films rather popular at the moment... which I don't like..

[Skynxnex]

What I haven't enjoyed seeing in the last two prequals was the 'cartoonish' Jedi fight sceens we were spared in TPM; I mean, I appreciate Yoda being 3ft tall poses a problem in a fight, but the sheer extent of the leaping about was more akin to rather over the top Hong Kong martial Art films rather popular at the moment... which I don't like..

 

 

Actually I didnt have a problem with those fights. The way I look at it is that if one was truly powerful in the force then your age doesnt matter. Plus it was nice for me anyway to see why everyone kept saying Yoda was so powerful.

[Jahled]

Actually I didnt have a problem with those fights. The way I look at it is that if one was truly powerful in the force then your age doesnt matter. Plus it was nice for me anyway to see why everyone kept saying Yoda was so powerful.

 

Granted dude, but: my qualm with the fight sceens was sort of like, for example you and me having a Jedi Duel inwhich one of us, quite frankly is hurling a teddy bear at the other.

 

*visualize mode*

[AdmiralFishface]

Is it a laser-teddy bear?

 

But I must say I didn't like the Yoda fights, either. Apart from the fact that I didn't want to see Yoda fight at all, all the jumping was to much.

 

Yoda shouldn't have needed to fight to show his power. It would have been a lot better if he'd just avoided or deflected every attack thrown at him (well, only if he wasn't scheduled for a large fight, of course. More than one or two scenes of this would become annoying).

Surely, in his 900 years of training Jedi, the wisdom of Wars not make one great must have come to him earlier.

 

Now the scene where he slams Palpatine's guards against the wall with barely a movement at all, that was great.

[Skynxnex]

Hahahaha hurling a teddy bear at each other. Oh my stomach.

[Prine]

The overuse of CGI irritates me, too. Probably half of any given film these days is shot in front of a blue screen with people in green suits. After a while all the high-tech editing stops looking impressive and starts looking cartoony, and actors always look awkward interacting with stuff that's not there.

[Eko]

I seem to remember at one point, that the actor who played Qui Gon in Epi. I said he detested acting against the blue screen as there was nothing to interact with...

[Chefslikeithot]

I did not think the movie was that bad. But the Palpatine's scars scene did suck. he sounded to foolish screamming "no" at Mace. But thats just me. I also thing Grievious went down to easy.

[Skynxnex]

I agree with most of the points brought up.

 

I want to just vent something that in my opinion is why the original A New Hope was so good even though Lucas directed it etc...

 

The reason why it was good is that Lucas didnt substitute special effects for story and character development etc.

 

In the prequels...Lucas has in my opinion allowed the 'story' to be substituted for the special effects. I will admit, the prequels have some amazing special effects. Really superb special effects, but special effects should be used to 'enhance' a story not be the story itself. I think Lucas has forgotten that and so we have the end result which are the prequels -- stories with too much special effects and not enough character.

[SOCL]

I believe that Revenge of the Sith more-or-less brought the prequels back to something closer to the glory of the original trilogy. Granted, this was no The Empire Strikes Back, it was certainly a spectacular movie. I wasn't too keen with Palpatine's "Don't let him kill me" plea to Anakin while frying himself against Windu's lightsaber, nor Windu's not-so-pained/real "argh"s. Further, Palpatine's "The Force is strong in you" when talking to a kneeled Anakin sounded too much like a blues singer saying it. Really, though, there weren't too many issues I had with the movie, and all-in-all I found it to be exactly what was needed (i.e. it was VERY sad). I don't know about everyone else, but I'm not a big fan of Jedi, yet I was horrified by the act of treason and mutiny committed by the clonetroopers against their generals. Granted, I do understand Order 66 was put into their "programming" since their beginning, it was still terrible to watch. The attack on the Jedi Temple was another part that really tore at me--yes, I am a softly, I nearly covered my eyes when Anakin walked in to kill the young Padawans (I hate the word "Younglings") thinking Lucas was actually going to show their deaths. Then Anakin's burning and his cry for Padme after becoming fully-suited Vader...though the cry seemed a wee-bit cheesey, it still go the point across.

 

Yes, my review and thoughts are scattered, but overall I enoyed the movie very much; so much, in fact, that I would dare to say it is my second favourite out of all the six (Empire is first).

[Prine]

This was a pretty amusing summary, I thought.

[Mad78]

Fun but a bit to agressive to my liking.

[Prine]

Heh, and he gave ROTS 5 out of 5.

[kaja]

My thoughts on the film...

 

Having the shild generator on the OUTSIDE of the ship was a stupid Idea.

The scene where R2-D2 killed the SBDs was Great.

Count Died way to easily.

Anakin Is an Idiot.

While the crash landing was cool, Anakin was an Idiot for crashing into the Control tower, Killing who knows how many People.

General Grievous Got defeated WAY to easily.

EpII Clone Troopers looked better than the new 'Half-Storm Half-EpII' Outfits.

Anakin is an Idiot

Ewan was great in this movie.

Mace's Death was Stupid.

The other three Jedi with Mace died WAAAAY to Easily.

Order 66 Was great.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot for Killing Younglings.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin Got what he deserved when he got decapitated.

The Dual was great.

Yoda gave up was to easily.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin is an Idiot.

Anakin turned to the dark side way to easily.

AND Anakin is an Idiot.

 

Other than Anakin Being an Idiot and Christensen being a terible Actor. I thought the movie was great.

 

That's All I have to say.

[Skynxnex]

Actually that 'shield' generator wasnt a shield generator for the ship as a whole. It was a simple atmosphere shield generator for the hangar bay. The Invisible Hand (Grievous' ship) according to the novel had been in a heavy engagement with Republic Venerators so its possible that during a broadside or something the rest of the shields were knocked down allowing Anakin and Obi Wan to shoot the atmospheric shield generator. That point didnt bother me, it was just some of the other special effects crap that Lucas had thrown in which substituted from the story and didnt add anything, yes nice eyecandy. Oh well.