Plot Ideas 1.1 (More Cohesive + More Long, etc)

[Guest JediIgor]

All right, I have some more cohesive ideas now for a plot.. let us begin (all the names are tentative by the way):

 

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Things to Know:

--There are three eras: Early, Middle, Late

 

--These are the factions: Americans [NA], Russians [CIS], Europeans [EU], China [PRC], Japan [JP], India/Pakistan [i/P]. Unplayable?: Nomads.

 

--Major technologies: thermal fusion, cold fusion, anti-matter, dyson spheres, wormholes, slingshot FTL, alien FTL

 

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Before Game Begins:

* 50 years from now: thermal fusion becomes mainstream, private spaceship industry flourishes and thousands of spaceships are built for short range travel, the solar system is quickly explored and charted

 

* 100 years from now: cold fusion becomes mainstream, slingshot FTL technology is developed (using a device that must rebuilt each time to make another FTL jump)

--short range FTL jumps are possible using cold fusion generators

--long range FTL jumps require more energy, for this a partial dyson sphere needs to be built

--early FTL technology means when jumping long distances you cannot jump backwards to the origin

 

* between 100-150 years: first explorers leave for nearby planets to drop off terraformers, most are not heard from again.

 

* 150 years from now: the dyson sphere achieves prototype status, thousands of space ships filled with explorers leave Earth forever to drop off terraformers on planets in hopes that people will one day colonize them. The explorers are kept in contact with Earth by FTL communications which are more mature than FTL travel.

 

* 160 years from now: anti-matter generators are invented, hopefully to bring break-throughs in the near future

 

* 170 years from now: a new type of FTL using wormhole generators is invented, however the wormhole generators are very expensive, and take years to build: on the other hand they allow back-and-forth travel. Colonization begins with nearby terraformed planets, with each major spacefaring country sponsoring their own colonies.

 

* 171 years from now: luddites destroy the FTL communications facilities; all explorers far away from Earth lose contact from Earth, only the local colonies stay in touch with each other. The explorers still have short-range contact with themselves.

 

* 171-200 years from now: some explorers run out of equipment to rebuild their slingshots with, and are forced to colonize on terraformed planets. Others go on, and find alien FTL, which soon enables them to makeshift a better version of their own FTL which can take them to any point in the galaxy and back to the origin. However, at this point in time they cannot get back to Earth since their earlier technology has prevented them from keeping these kind of records. The alien FTL is passed on to all the local explorers (which are now hundreds of light years away from Earth), now dubbed the Nomads.

 

-- To make more efficient slingshot jumps, and to better survive in space, the Nomads have two choices: either take mind altering drugs, or become part cyborg. Some choose the former, some choose the latter. After generations of drug/robotic usage, the Nomads hardly resemble the humans anymore.

 

-- Meanwhile with the discovery of anti-matter, Earth has advances in nanotechnology which enables them to make more efficient gene splicing. Soon, the usage of drugs or transformations into cyborgs is forsaken in favor of better and faster DNA, while still retaining their outward human form.

 

* 200 years from now: With over 20 planets in the "known" (to the Earth humans) galaxy colonized by Earth, and at least 10-20 more unaffiliated to any Earth government, the local Earth colonies are striving well: many solar systems have wormhole generators now and travel times are slowly improving.

 

-- During this time, the Nomads have veered far away from Earth. Using their alien FTL drives they can make jumps anywhere they want -- many Nomads tire of exploring, and they soon colonize a few planets of their own, forming a loose confederation of colonies. This quickly enables them to make full use of the alien technology, and around this time they have almost fully reverse-engineered the alien tech, granting them a level of Star Trek technology.

 

* 201 years from now: crazy Earth scientist claims ascension to higher planes of existence is not too far off

 

* 202 years from now: superstring theory proven as the news is transmitted to all corners of the known galaxy and broadcasted live from Earth, everyone becomes familiar with the device making it possible.

 

* 202 years from now, 5 minutes after the former: All communications with Earth cease. When ships are sent through a wormhole to the Earth coordinates, they do not arrive at the Sol system. Earth is deemed gone, panic ensues throughout the colonies, formerly administrated by the nations of Earth.

 

-- Meanwhile on Earth.. proving superstring theory had its costs: the dimensions used for wormhole travel have been grossly affected by the superstring device, and Earth's 5-7 dimensions used for wormhole travel have shifted. In effect, the 1-3 dimensions for Earth are still there, but it is unreachable by conventional wormhole travel.

 

-- Within days, the crazy aforementioned scientist figures out how to use superstring theory to help him ascend: soon he ascends, taking everyone on Earth with him. To ascend is to unlock all the secrets of the universe in one's head, and to live in a higher plane of existence: some people cannot handle the "turning on the light bulb in their head," and unprepared, they die during the ascension. Earth is soon emptied of every living soul. Those that make the transition quickly decide not to mettle with corporeal affairs.

 

-- On the other planets, order quickly breaks down. Planets administered by their nations quickly unite in a transition government: many lose their right of democracy as military coups happen over the galaxy. Uneasy peace remains, but it is only a matter of time before war will break out.

 

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The Game Begins.. 202 years from now, after Earth disappears

 

--Early Era

 

The game starts out with the player picking a faction, and then his reformed government type. Peace does not reign for long, and war soon breaks loose. With Earth not there to restrict the expansion, the factions each try to grab as much planets from each other, as well as find and colonize the planets terraformed by the earlier explorers.

 

--Early Technology Synopsis

 

For Early Technology, I believe Battlestar Galactica is a very good description of what we can have: slow capital ships armed with nuclear missiles and rail guns, and small agile fighters armed with powerful machine guns used for assaulting the capital ships. Couple that with standard ship navy classes such as destroyers, battleships, carriers, and you have a real navy situation for the game. Weapon/defense wise you do not have any lasers, as those are used for heating food, and particle shields are a pipe dream. Ground-wise you have a more advanced version of the U.S. army -- troops armed with machine guns, jeeps, hovertanks, etc. Until now there have not been any galactic wars, and so the military has not had its necessary funds to really become powerful.

 

--The Goal

 

Some think Earth is not lost. The goal is to find Earth again. Until then, the factions will engage in diplomacy, war, expansion, research, etc. Once a certain point in the tech tree is hit, we will advance to the Middle Era.

 

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--Middle Era

 

With colonies unrestricted by the conservative Earth government, the factions grow into bigger planet-spanning states -- their produced technology has finally caught up with the theoretical.

 

At this point, the borders of the "known" galaxy are about to be broken. Some early explorers' colonies are found, and integrated into one of the factions. However, all the planets farther away are wild and unknown to the factions -- the exploring is yet to begin!

 

As the exploring goes underway, the humans find remnants of ancient civilizations -- constructed yet broken dyson spheres, ruins of buildings on planetary surfaces, and even alien ship hulks! When scientists get their hands on the ships, they realize that the aliens had better working FTL capabilities.

 

Soon, one of the factions reverse-engineers the FTL -- the other factions retrieve this intelligence via the spy networks days later; nevertheless, it is only a matter of time before the first FTL drives are built into ships.

 

The alien FTL is truly a miracle: wormhole generators are no longer necessary, as the FTL enables them to jump almost anywhere the ships want. It takes only days before someone has a bright idea to use the alien FTL to jump to Earth.

 

But Earth is there. For some time, it has been inaccessible via the wormhole, but the alien FTL uses completely different dimensions to travel via the galaxy. The faction that finds Earth quickly takes it over, only to discover that the planet has been emptied. Hints are given that the people may have been ascended, but many dismiss this.

 

The humans quickly realize that the ruler of Earth may unite everyone, and riots erupt across the galaxy. Other factions quickly send out strike forces to capture Earth for themselves so that they may be proclaimed the ruler of the known galaxy.

 

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--Late Era

 

The superstring device proves almost invaluable in deciphering the aliens' technology -- breakthroughs happen almost daily, and soon the humans are well on their way to having technology rivaling that of the Nomads (which still have not been seen for years).

 

Still, more and more alien remains are found weekly, and humans wonder if this alien race is truly extinct. Many remains are too old to be traced, and they wonder what it would be like if the aliens ever came back.

 

On one average day, one of the factions detect a fleet with unknown signatures. Believing that it is a rival faction set out for a sneak attack, they engage the unknown fleet in battle:

 

-- They engage the Nomads! After decades of travelling the galaxy, the Nomads look nothing like humans, and in the midst of confusion they believe they may have encountered the aliens! With their at this time superior technology (after all, they had more time to get used to it), they manage to defeat the human fleet.

 

-- Soon the Nomads send out their entire navy -- outpost by outpost of the human factions disappears. The humans are in a disarray, as they too believe they may have encountered the aliens.

 

As the Nomads go on a rampage across the colonies, the Humans have no choice but to band together (or do they?). In the beginning they lose, but soon they figure out ways to fight the Nomads -- not all hope is lost.

 

In fact, because the Nomads have no knowledge of the superstring device, their technological progress has been relatively slower than that of the Humans'. The Humans quickly figure out how they can fight back the Nomads..

 

-- At this point, the biggest fleet ever before is sent out to Earth by the Nomads. But no battle takes place. After months of fighting, they finally realize that they are actually humans as well! A peace treaty is offered to the ruler of Earth.

 

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--Post Game (or Post-Late Era)

 

At this point many things could happen: This could signify the end of the game, or a beginning of the fourth era.

 

Either the ruler of Earth will accept the treaty, and the game can end, or a civil war can break out between the Humans as they do not want to get subjugated by the new Earth Ruler/Nomad treaty. Additionally, the drug/cyborg sub-factions of the Nomads could also start a Civil War between each other, as the genetically spliced humans are not too fond of the cyborgs.

 

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--The End

 

The game can then end in a few ways: Here are some possibilities..

 

1. The human player becomes ruler of everyone, either by conquest, or by diplomatic treaties.

2. Someone messes up a dyson sphere and it starts a chain reaction of stars that blow up, wiping out the galaxy (not fun, huh?)

3. If you are humane enough, a few ascendants break their rules of not messing with corporeal beings and decide to stop the destruction. Then your scientists finally figure out the way to ascend based on the knowledge gathered from Earth, most people ascend and it's a happy ending.

4. A bunch of trigger happy aliens come back to the galaxy from a long vacation and finding it ruled by some mammals decide to unleash their forces and kill everyone who didn't ascend.

 

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--Unrelated Talk

 

Well.. here it is, it's taken me over an hour, but I hope you guys like it!

 

I originally planned to talk about "divine powers" in here as well, but it had no really big relevance to the major story, I did not. I will talk about it another day.

 

More details, suggestions, etc? Please do!

Edited March 15, 2005 by JediIgor

[Stellar_Magic]

Hmmm... The Dyson Sphere shouldn't be available until the very late period of the game, considering it involves completely disassembling a solar systems planets in order to create a shield like sphere around the star.

 

A couple notes, scifi writers have theorized the following eras of civilizations based on their power sources.

 

1. Fire Power, combustion is used for all sources of fire (This goes from stone age to the 1950s on earth)

 

2. Fission Power, Earth's current technological state where the breaking of atoms into their component parts produces power.

 

3. Fusion Power, this stage could be divided into two parts, hot and cold, based on the two methods for power production. An international coalition is currently organized to construct the first 'Hot' fusion reactor (It's construction is being slowed by an argument about its placement Japan or France your pick).

 

4. Antimatter-Matter Reactions, the combination of matter and antimatter reactions in a reactor releases enormous amounts of clean energy that is used for all manner of purposes.

 

5. Quantum Power, also known as a quantum singularity engine, quantum power uses a minature black hole to generate power and is inherently unstable.

 

6. Advanced state, the civilization has achieved the most advanced thought possible, advanced spaceflight, instantanious travel, and matter - energy conversion become everyday events. The Dyson spheres become reality. -It is also at this point that Transcendence or Ascention would occur if possible.

 

Jedi Igor, while I applaud your timeline, I see one major problem, technological development seems to be happening too quickly, specifically when it comes to exceptional leaps such as faster then light travel, and advanced spaceflight. Firstly there are two forms of scientific knowledge, applied and theoretical, we have not been able to truly apply Einstein's relativity to any commercial venture. How long would it take for the discoveries that Superstring theory will unleash to make it into applications? A hundred years, two hundred years.

 

Perhaps at game start we set the player back by quite a bit, we force them to use sublight technologies and simple distance creates the different factions.

 

Moreover I think the order of some technological innovations is wrong. Wormhole generators are the epitimy of interstellar transportation, they provide instantaneous travel between points in space. Moreover it has been theorized that development of Wormhole generation technology requires the invention of gravitational effecting technology analogous to a warp drive.

 

Here is the order of technologies I would use in this game:

 

Early Game:

Solar sails enable colonization of worlds and transits between worlds but such voyages are extremely long ranging from four years to Alpha Centauri on up. Moreover upon reaching the ship's destination all communications with the home base would be hopelessly lagged, due to the time it would take for information or orders to arrive. Space is very much a wild frontier and factions split by both idealogy and nationality appear. These factions exist within the broder nations of Earth: America, China, Japan... etc, but develop their own unique identity due to isolation, revolutions on these planets is quite possible, as are general rebellions. As leader of a democratic state it is more then possible that you will have to appease these diverse groups to maintain control, the early game is clearly a game of diplomacy, both inside the faction and outside. Totalitarian rule is possible, but difficult to maintain due to the isolation of your many star systems.

 

--Nomads, these are beings that leave your nation in this stage of the game and cut their ties with earth and head into space searching for worlds to truly call their own.

 

Warfare: The situation in terms of warfare is roughly analogous to the difficulties facing Britain in the 18th century, launching attacks often takes an inordinate amount of time and the combat situation has inevitably changed during the interceeding years, you are constantly forced to make your best guesses as to enemy movements and forcast the situation years ahead of you, moreover you must plan for any number of contingencies. If that wasn't enough it will take time for your worlds to find out that a state of war has been declared or a cease fire. Much like the battle of New Orleans in 1812 combat can take places for long after a cease fire has been signed.

 

Mid Game:

The invention of interdimension and warp travel takes place in this era, you may find that many of your problems with communications have been eliminated, but not entirely. Ships travel faster then radio messages so the old radio wave has been replaced by courier vessels. The transit between stars has been cut from years or even tens of years to a matter of months or weeks. You may still suffer communications difficulties, but alas, such is life. Technology in general continues to improve and you may find your communications problems over after the invention of a gravitational or subspace communications. FTL travel remains extremely limited, your ships cannot be recalled while FTL and have enormous recharge and alignment times for a jump to FTL speeds. Weapons technology begins to diversify with the invention of lasers, pulse weapons, disruptors, antimatter rail guns, antimatter torpedoes, plasma cannons, and gravitational mines. Shielding for protection against weapons fire becomes a reality for the first time with the invention of magnetic shields. Shields will continue to develop throughout this period.

 

--Earth disappears in the accident described, further severing the bonds between the nations. Unrest on worlds and an increased aggressiveness between nations and factions takes hold.

 

--Nomads have by this time set up their own empire on the opposite end of the Galaxy.

 

Warfare: Think Battlestar Galactica, Star Trek, and Star Wars as technology progresses and changes. Your forces will be able to quickly ready themselves for battle and engage the enemy, however you must remain careful, because due to the communications problems you suffer early in the game your forces are vulnerable to preemptive strikes. You have to be adaptable and resourceful in order to move to combat new threats as they appear and develop new tactics in order to utilize the weapons that will continue to be developed. This period is one which will probably be conflict ridden and very tricky to master.

 

Late Game:

One word, wormholes. The development of wormhole generators will give you instantaneous communication and transportation. These advancements will give you benefits over your rivals that will revolutionize the way in which warfare occurs. Moreover your nation will become more united as trade and even simple everyday comutting from place to place becomes possible. Dyson spheres can finally be built enabling you to create worlds that can support populations thousands of times larger then a single planet. You'll be able to expand and colonize worlds previously beyond your reach. Science begins to advance at a perilously fast pace, and ascention becomes a true possibility.

 

--Nomads return to your side of the Galaxy and begin to actively compete against the nations of earth.

 

Warfare: Even if you knocked out the other nations early in the game, you still have one enemy left to fight, the Nomads. You'll fidn that this war will be waged on an hour by hour basis. An actual war may take only a matter of weeks to wage due to the advancements in technology. Combat is roughtly conducted on a manner similar to modern earth bound warfare. Moreover due to wormhole technology there is no definite front, enemies can drop in behind your lines and blast a planet out of existance. This is basically the armaggedon stage of the game, win or die.

 

So JI what do you think of my take on this?

[teukros]

Well of course it's all fantasy, and one man's fantasy is as good as any other's. The important thing is, does he tell the story well?

 

In reality, we're all trapped inside relativistic prison cells that we cannot break out of. Non-priviledged frames of reference imply that superluminal transmission of information (of which FTL travel would be an example) is not simply impossible according to our current knowledge, it is Prohibited.

[Stellar_Magic]

Unfortunately you live in the world of Relativity, I however have been enlightened by the world of string theory. Your limits on movement and travel are all unfortunately out of date. With the interdimensional nature of the universe inherit in string theory everything we've just proposed is not only possible but likely.

 

So likely in fact that a team of respected british scientists just released a research paper that states that the most likely form of first contact scenario is in fact aliens landing on earth... "Take me to your leader ."

 

Sorry Teukros, the laws of relativity are violated nonstop in the actions of subatomic particles, thats why Einstein spent most of his life trying to create an all inclusive theory a.k.a. The Theory of Everything (TOE). Most scientists now believe that String theory is in fact the (TOE) thereby your little relativistic prison has a giant open window.

[teukros]

People used to say the same things about Quantum Mechanics.

 

Hmmm I know a little bit about String Theory and it's interesting if largely speculative, but I don't see how it invalidates e.g. Lorentz Transformations...

[AdmiralFishface]

"If someone told you that something will be possible at some point in the future, he's probably right. If the same person told you something will never be possible, he's probably wrong."

I don't believe in FTL anything right now, but I will when someone proves it's possible. So far, noone has. That does, however, not impact the story.

 

Something completely different:

I'd like to connect the stories of the Nomads and Earth. Maybe the Nomads will be willing to engage in peace if Earth has already been found (which happens quite early in the story, it could take place later) when they somehow recognize it as their home planet.

They could also have the key to ascendance, some piece of knowledge or technology they found on their voyage.

 

So in order to ascend you need 1) control over Earth or the necessary knowledge (stolen from whoever controls the planet), 2) the Key, which will be only granted to you if you can make peace with the Nomads or manage to get it from them by force (very difficult) or steal it from them (also very difficult).

 

Otherwise you can just wipe out everything and not ascend but still win. The more possibilities to win, the better.

[Mad78]

I like that idea Fishface

[Guest JediIgor]

I like that idea Fishface

 

Hmm, doesn't that strike you as a bit of a ripoff from Alpha Centauri? Otherwise ascending would be cool, but the Nomads definitely shouldn't hold the Key in that case (they are robots! barely humans anymore ).

 

Hmmm... The Dyson Sphere shouldn't be available until the very late period of the game, considering it involves completely disassembling a solar systems planets in order to create a shield like sphere around the star.

 

Hmm, actually, according to this:

http://www.nada.kth.se/~asa/dysonFAQ.html

It's already possible to start building a type-i dyson sphere with our current technology. I certainly wasn't talking about a type-iii or a submerged dyson sphere .

 

A couple notes, scifi writers have theorized the following eras of civilizations based on their power sources.

and I could be wrong, but wasn't most of that stuff in order that I listed already? Ascension may be closer than you think if you believe in Stargate SG-1 anyways .

 

Perhaps at game start we set the player back by quite a bit, we force them to use sublight technologies and simple distance creates the different factions.

Yeah, let's totally force the player to use STL, I mean the closest star is only 4.2 light years away! That would make for some awesome games, lol :-\. FTL is just necessary if we want to make something fun like Rebellion.

 

Moreover I think the order of some technological innovations is wrong. Wormhole generators are the epitimy of interstellar transportation, they provide instantaneous travel between points in space. Moreover it has been theorized that development of Wormhole generation technology requires the invention of gravitational effecting technology analogous to a warp drive.

A warp drive? The stuff that makes you fly faster than light? I was thinking more like folding space, ala slipstream from Andromeda.

 

Here is the order of technologies I would use in this game:

 

Early Game:

As leader of a democratic state it is more then possible that you will have to appease these diverse groups to maintain control, the early game is clearly a game of diplomacy, both inside the faction and outside. Totalitarian rule is possible, but difficult to maintain due to the isolation of your many star systems.

We can still do the stuff I quoted above, and not have to use solar sails. Think about how long travel would take, and how completely different the game would be if someone got FTL even a few days earlier than all the other players.

 

If that wasn't enough it will take time for your worlds to find out that a state of war has been declared or a cease fire. Much like the battle of New Orleans in 1812 combat can take places for long after a cease fire has been signed.

Aside from the obvious (the player knows all), I don't see why FTL communication cannot be achieved sooner than FTL travel. It is after all only passing information, and that is far easier than moving matter .

 

--Earth disappears in the accident described, further severing the bonds between the nations. Unrest on worlds and an increased aggressiveness between nations and factions takes hold.

But then we couldn't call the game something like Earth Exigency .

 

--Nomads have by this time set up their own empire on the opposite end of the Galaxy.

Hmm that sure happened fast, I mean just a few months ago everyone was using STL .

 

Warfare: Think Battlestar Galactica, Star Trek, and Star Wars as technology progresses and changes. Your forces will be able to quickly ready themselves for battle and engage the enemy, however you must remain careful, because due to the communications problems you suffer early in the game your forces are vulnerable to preemptive strikes. You have to be adaptable and resourceful in order to move to combat new threats as they appear and develop new tactics in order to utilize the weapons that will continue to be developed. This period is one which will probably be conflict ridden and very tricky to master.

Are you talking about BSG TOS, because in TNS they are using stuff that doesn't seem too far off once we start getting serious about space flight . But a Star Trek ship could probably whoop Galactica considering they have shields, phasers and can go to warp at any time . Heck, they'd just send a bunch of photos torpedos, warp away, warp back, etc.

 

So JI what do you think of my take on this?

 

I think you're a pessimist . We are decades away from fusion power, nanotechnology is within our grasp, and the space industry is on its way towards becoming privated, now. Quantum computing has also begun to make progress, so once we are able to use quantum computers, our potentials will skyrocket .

 

But even if some stuff does seem far fetched, it doesn't have to be impossible. More importantly, keep in mind the gameplay: not only do we want to keep it fun (and STL is just not fun), it will also help us if it's easy to make a Star Wars mod off it .

[Stellar_Magic]

I was thinking of a type iii, sorry. JI

 

Aside from the obvious (the player knows all), I don't see why FTL communication cannot be achieved sooner than FTL travel. It is after all only passing information, and that is far easier than moving matter Smile.

 

Wrong, because ALL and I do mean ALL, communications thus far contemplated require the use of light waves therefore all communications are shackaled by the speed of light. The only way for a message to get through faster then the speed of light would be the creation of a gravitational array or what I've com to refer as a hypercom. A hypercom is a pair of transmitters which can create a miniature wormhole through which messages can be beamed.

 

Yeah, let's totally force the player to use STL, I mean the closest star is only 4.2 light years away! That would make for some awesome games, lol :-\. FTL is just necessary if we want to make something fun like Rebellion.

 

Okay now I see what lense you're viewing this. Perhaps this could help out your fears, I'd suggest making it so that you have two possible starting points in the game, pre FTL and post FTL. For pre FTL all the problems inherit in what I've suggested will be allowed, from Time Dilation, to Look Back Time. (I'd make these two features optional and only recomend them for very advanced and patient players) I just really want to try and tackle the strategic problems posed by those situations.

 

Hmm that sure happened fast, I mean just a few months ago everyone was using STL Smile.

 

They reversed engineered an alien FTL drive that enabled them to move quicker. Also who said months, I was thinking more like 100 years!

 

Are you talking about BSG TOS, because in TNS they are using stuff that doesn't seem too far off once we start getting serious about space flight Smile. But a Star Trek ship could probably whoop Galactica considering they have shields, phasers and can go to warp at any time Smile. Heck, they'd just send a bunch of photos torpedos, warp away, warp back, etc.

 

I'm talking about the new BSG, I understand my statement was somewhat confusing. In BSG they have FTL travel, but their military forces are still much less advanced. The BSG-ST-SW is written in that order for a reason, all the technologies seen in the series would fall within the middle era. FTL travel, Pulse Weapons, High end Lasers, Disruptors...

 

I think you're a pessimist Smile. We are decades away from fusion power, nanotechnology is within our grasp, and the space industry is on its way towards becoming privated, now. Quantum computing has also begun to make progress, so once we are able to use quantum computers, our potentials will skyrocket Smile.

 

But even if some stuff does seem far fetched, it doesn't have to be impossible. More importantly, keep in mind the gameplay: not only do we want to keep it fun (and STL is just not fun), it will also help us if it's easy to make a Star Wars mod off it Smile.

 

I still disagree with the STL stuff mostly because I really appreciate the dynamics of warfare during the age of sail. Okay so it takes a craft 5-6 Years to get to another solar system, big deal, that early in the game you'll be focused on gobbling up technologies and setting up colonies within our own solar system. Moreover if you manage to create a colony within an open star cluster or nebula You've got plenty of planets easily within your reach, you just have to adjust your strategy to meet the demands early in the game, thats why I suggested that STL only be given as an optional start point, for the really advanced players that want a challenge...like me. Plus if we enable the creation of deep space colonies as well as planetary bases...

 

Moreover in Star Wars you actually saw Han Solo travel to three systems with just his sublight engine in The Empire Strikes Back. Perhaps we could fudge the distances a bit and put stars closer together then they really are, or give the player a starting point in an open star cluster to enable the swift start to his empire even with STL travel.

 

At least be sure to make it so that its possible to insert through modifications.

[Guest JediIgor]

Wrong, because ALL and I do mean ALL, communications thus far contemplated require the use of light waves therefore all communications are shackaled by the speed of light. The only way for a message to get through faster then the speed of light would be the creation of a gravitational array or what I've com to refer as a hypercom. A hypercom is a pair of transmitters which can create a miniature wormhole through which messages can be beamed.

Thus far.. hehe.. look at it this way: we can already move information at very high speeds, almost instanteously. Not so for matter. Now if we are going to imagine FTL, then we might as well imagine it being analogous to our current communication systems, and so FTL comm would have to be more developed than FTL travel.

 

Okay now I see what lense you're viewing this. Perhaps this could help out your fears, I'd suggest making it so that you have two possible starting points in the game, pre FTL and post FTL. For pre FTL all the problems inherit in what I've suggested will be allowed, from Time Dilation, to Look Back Time. (I'd make these two features optional and only recomend them for very advanced and patient players) I just really want to try and tackle the strategic problems posed by those situations.

Read below where I address these "strategic problems."

 

They reversed engineered an alien FTL drive that enabled them to move quicker. Also who said months, I was thinking more like 100 years!

Ok, so if you start pre-FTL I can see every minute of real time being played in a year of game time.

 

I'm talking about the new BSG, I understand my statement was somewhat confusing. In BSG they have FTL travel, but their military forces are still much less advanced. The BSG-ST-SW is written in that order for a reason, all the technologies seen in the series would fall within the middle era. FTL travel, Pulse Weapons, High end Lasers, Disruptors...

Well BSG is pretty weird, I mean if they had FTL you'd think they would have at least particle weapons instead of machine guns (for their marines). As for Star Wars, that's just really crazy to put their tech in a game that's otherwise realistic -- an Imperial Star Destroyer use more power than some planets can hope to generate in their entire lifetime!

 

I still disagree with the STL stuff mostly because I really appreciate the dynamics of warfare during the age of sail. Okay so it takes a craft 5-6 Years to get to another solar system, big deal, that early in the game you'll be focused on gobbling up technologies and setting up colonies within our own solar system.

Lol boring beginning, huh?

 

I thought you saw my point when I said the nearest star was pretty far away though? It's not like reaching the New World in 6 months and then you have "unlimited" places to colonize. And if you are fighting in Europe, it takes weeks/days to move anything, not years. Hell, if you send out a fleet and it takes 5 years to get somewhere, it may arrive to the enemy planet and be completely obsolete.

 

Plus, what if someone gets FTL? Even if it's a month early? They can take over the galaxy with ease... . Just mass all their fleets into one big one and FTL it all over the place.

 

But more importantly, the time to travel between places during the age of sail was far, far smaller than between different stars at LS.

 

Moreover if you manage to create a colony within an open star cluster or nebula You've got plenty of planets easily within your reach, you just have to adjust your strategy to meet the demands early in the game, thats why I suggested that STL only be given as an optional start point, for the really advanced players that want a challenge...like me. Plus if we enable the creation of deep space colonies as well as planetary bases...

You know that would really really resemble Rome: Total War In Space, except that reinforcements would be useless and you couldn't hold out a siege for a few years in space. If Germany blitzkrieged through Europe in a couple of months, and it takes a couple of years for reinforcements to arrive then the whole planet will fall to the invading enemy.

 

So if we had FTL travel, the defenses only need to hold for a few hours, until reinforcements arrive.. pre-FTL you are screwed either way, the planet WILL be lost when one side has an overwhelming advantage.

 

Unless you made planetary battles last "years," which would be very stupid.

 

Hey, I guess it could work.. but battles of any kind in pre-FTL would be pretty useless. The "time" factor (i.e. how quickly can I crush his defences and install mine in place?) would be useless because of how long it would take for reinforcements to arrive.

 

And yes, I want battles to be real-time and for reinforcements to arrive during battles, unlike in Rebellion . They do it in pretty much any movie/book, so why not in a game!

Moreover in Star Wars you actually saw Han Solo travel to three systems with just his sublight engine in The Empire Strikes Back. Perhaps we could fudge the distances a bit and put stars closer together then they really are, or give the player a starting point in an open star cluster to enable the swift start to his empire even with STL travel.

 

At least be sure to make it so that its possible to insert through modifications.

 

He.. did..? I don't remember, and you have to remember that the Star Wars galaxy is radically different from ours. Maybe they have a different speed of light there, or they aren't restricted at 1.0 LS max velocity. Also, remember the sun crusher. It never used hyperspace to travel, so there you go .

 

To sum it up.. you can't just have a game called age of sail in space. It's radically different. If you want age of sail in space you can always try to mod a naval game to put it into the space setting. Although if anyone can address the issue of battles being useless pre-FTL, then by all means go ahead .