Madness

[Guest Scathane]

Today, around nine 9 AM GMT+1, Theo van Gogh, writer, columnist, filmmaker and controversial opinionist was cowardly shot and stabbed to death. Although I can readily admit to not always sharing his opinion nor the words he chose to vent it, it's an outrage that I seem to live in a country where people sometimes have to pay with their lives for speaking their minds. The madness of it.

 

Full story here.

[Jahled]

Just been watching this on the news.

 

Europe, the Western world, must very quickly get to grips with it's very cool multi cultural make up, and stop tolerating people; in this obvious instance Muslims with fascist views, the right to dwell amongst us.

 

It seems just because they are Muslim and most of the time of another skin complexion, certain elements of their community can get away with mouthing off fascist ideas that if they were white, shaven headed, and working class would be demonized instantly as being Nazis in the media and the circles of intelligent thought. Enough!

 

If people are unhappy with western liberal democracy and our right to make challenging films about how women are abused in cultures like Islam they know where the airport is. They can sod of with my spit behind them. Hindus, the Chinese, Sikhs, etc don't cause the trouble elements of the Muslim community do. They just get on with their lives and enrich our cultures as a consequence. Islam, these days, is rapidly becomming the world's pain. I just wonder where all those fools who wore 'Bad Religion' tee-shirts are now with a crescent instead of a cross. Better than that, replace with a brain. The Muslim world seems to lack it.

[Cain]

An interesting topic disscution about muslims :

 

See Link

 

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=13295

[Trejiuvanat]

Today, around nine 9 AM GMT+1, Theo van Gogh, writer, columnist, filmmaker and controversial opinionist was cowardly shot and stabbed to death. Although I can readily admit to not always sharing his opinion nor the words he chose to vent it, it's an outrage that I seem to live in a country where people sometimes have to pay with their lives for speaking their minds. The madness of it.

 

Full story here.

 

 

In Costa Rica there was a reporter who had a radio show in which he denounced corruption of public figures (politicians, church, etc) he had previously investigated. He spoke his opinion about it, and parodied them. He was murdered by paid assassins.

 

Last year December, another reporter linked to this same case was murdered. Her murder was most likely perpetrated by the ones who killed the guy above.

 

Justice has been delayed for about two years. Members of the band of assassins were captured and are sitting in jail (preventive prison, there has not been a trial yet), but their leader who knew who had paid them, died during a foiled bank robbery. Two public figures are tacticly linked to the murder and are sittting in preventive prison, but there has not been a confirmation...

 

Jahled, I think you are being a bit harsh on the Muslim people. There are extremists there just as there are extremists in our "liberal" western "democracy", and there is a lack of brains here just as there is a lack of brains there. Sure there are assholes, like Bin-Laden, Hussein, the folk in Sudan who kill people (even their own) as if they were flies. But just like that there are people who declare war just to come out of an economic recession, and encourage economic growth. The more extremist folks in the U.S. are just as xenophobic and "fascist" as Muslims can be.

 

The Muslim's are the world's pain in the arse, because the world has taken a huge interest in them and their potential riches (petrol anyone?). The West have begun to push harder in their incursion into Mideast, Israel, now Iraq.For the average Iraqi the situation is as every bit as miserable as it was before the invasion. Palestianians well, we all have heard plenty of this.

 

Cuturally speaking, Islam more than a religion is an entire system to live by; the Coran and the Sunna have rules of etiquette, moral precepts and governmental and religious "laws". Under such a system you'd expect them to behave a lot different, than we do, since our laws are not dictated by the church. Islam is too much alike to Catholicism, but the few differences between both religions have historically set them apart. We must know that they are different. I mean, all this about brutalizing women, out western culture had it still a few hundred years ago, if you look up statistics in Mexico, Guatemala you'll see that women killed because of "domestic agression" still make up a considerable sum of deaths. About public executions, China still had them at the beginning of the century, and to have folks watch as a criminal is fried on the electric chair is no different and serves to the same purpose.

 

Conclusion, our world sucks...

[Guest Scathane]

I agree with Trej that Jahled's a bit harsh on Muslims. On the other hand I feel it can't be denied that the killer I referred to nailed a note with Koran texts to his victim's chest. Theo van Gogh was recently threatened for making a Muslim critic movie with Ayaan Hirshi Ali, an Ethiopian women who was circumcised as a Muslima in her home country (she later denounced the Islam and has been threatened as well).

[Imperator2]

I'm with Jahled on this one

 

Jahled wrote:-

 

If people are unhappy with western liberal democracy and our right to make challenging films about how women are abused in cultures like Islam they know where the airport is. They can sod of with my spit behind them. Hindus, the Chinese, Sikhs, etc don't cause the trouble elements of the Muslim community do. They just get on with their lives and enrich our cultures

 

Never were truer words spoken.

[Jahled]

Just been watching this on the news.

 

Europe, the Western world, must very quickly get to grips with it's very cool multi cultural make up, and stop tolerating people; in this obvious instance Muslims with fascist views, the right to dwell amongst us.

 

It seems just because they are Muslim and most of the time of another skin complexion, certain elements of their community can get away with mouthing off fascist ideas that if they were white, shaven headed, and working class would be demonized instantly as being Nazis in the media and the circles of intelligent thought. Enough!

 

If people are unhappy with western liberal democracy and our right to make challenging films about how women are abused in cultures like Islam they know where the airport is. They can sod of with my spit behind them. Hindus, the Chinese, Sikhs, etc don't cause the trouble elements of the Muslim community do. They just get on with their lives and enrich our cultures as a consequence. Islam, these days, is rapidly becomming the world's pain. I just wonder where all those fools who wore 'Bad Religion' tee-shirts are now with a crescent instead of a cross. Better than that, replace with a brain. The Muslim world seems to lack it.

 

I've never quoted myself before!

 

Muslims with fascist views

 

This does not imply all have. Doh!

 

It seems just because they are Muslim and most of the time of another skin complexion, certain elements of their community can get away with mouthing off fascist ideas that if they were white, shaven headed, and working class would be demonized instantly as being Nazis in the media and the circles of intelligent thought. Enough!

 

Can minorities get away with similar nasty views as people into fascist/racsist politics because it is excused as 'cultural.' That does not make their views exceptable.

 

certain elements of their community

 

My first point again.

 

Islam, these days, is rapidly becomming the world's pain.

 

Badly phrased on part, given I was not entriely implying the world's pain is entirely their fault! So i'll hit myself. I can't even remember what this point was, so I wont try and readdress it.

 

just wonder where all those fools who wore 'Bad Religion' tee-shirts are now with a crescent instead of a cross. Better than that, replace with a brain. The Muslim world seems to lack it.

 

I can count the Muslim democracies on one hand, with fingers to spare. Of those who do have elections such as Iran, I do not consider a society governed ultimately by religious Mullahs dictating what people can think a liberal society.

 

Any of you guys remember those 'bad religion' tee shirts the kids into grunge music used to wear? Just as a thought and try and imagine the storm if the cross was replaced by a crescent. The hypocracy sucks.

 

It seems the western world is very good at knocking itself, and overly apologetic to minorities; some of whome preech extremely nasty views on living, such as upon the girls amongst us, not least.

 

Ultimately, I am sick to death of religious idiots quoting God all the time, like some idiot in another thread. Elvis was a commited Christian but didn't feel the need to shuve it in our faces all the time. I don't have a problem with any major religion. I just have a problem with religious fanatics, not least taking the high ground with divine morality.

 

God's hardly going to a Muslim or a Christian, is it?